REVIEW
We Are One Arrival A130 & A140
One Platform - Four Bikes
For anyone new to the Arrival Project, I have a collection of links, shocks, and forks, such that I can run the Kamloopsian super-bike in any of their travel formats: A130, A152, A170, or the off-menu A140. And I'm working on writing about all of them.
Today I'll be mainly discussing the A130 & A140. Two options separated by 5mm of shock stroke. First though, a few words about the Arrival A170. For riding the North Shore, or any beefy black and double black trail network, the A170 is my general Arrival recommendation. Put against any of the other configurations, it gives up relatively little in the climbing department compared to the gains in confidence and control on the downhills.
This journey started with a We Are One Arrival 152 SP1. A fast-as-f*** bike that, despite my best efforts, certainly wasn't right for me. (Photo: The Clairebarian)
If nothing else, this process has been a reminder of the massive performance differences that can be achieved via subtle changes to a bike. This over-forked A130 is almost the same bike, yet not the same bike at all.
I easily moved on from the A170 to compare these other models due to rubber. The EXO+ DHR2 and Assegai MaxxTerra tires on the Arrival suit the other applications well, but the A170 screams for a more damped casing and higher grip rubber, especially for the front. For my next instalment, I'll be comparing the A170 against a coil-sprung A140 and I'll have more aggressive tires and inserts in play. The A170 is clearly an Enduro bike with climbing chops. The A130/A140 I'll be talking about today is a trail bike I can take anywhere.
We Are One Arrival A130
We Are One Arrival A152
We Are One Arrival A170
From A130 to A140
I put in a fair number of hours on the Arrival A130 with a 140mm Manitou Mattoc Pro mounted up front and was sitting down to write something when I started thinking about seat tube angles (STA). Comparatively, as rear travel decreases, effective seat tube angles should get slacker if for no other reason than to maintain pedaling position since they'll have less sag. For example, in addition to being lighter, I'd expect a Rocky Mountain Element to have a slacker STA than their longer travel Altitude.
This is of course one of the two main negatives of bikes like the Arrival that use one front triangle to derive a number of models. The front triangle geometry is fixed so links, shocks, and fork length change all angles or none of them. The other negative is that the frames have to be built to soak up the riding of their most aggressive application. What's reasonable for a 170mm Enduro bike becomes an over-built 130mm rig relative to purpose-built trail bikes.
The A130 and A140 share the thinner top shock link and shorter Trunnion bolts.
The A140 and A152 share the 185x55mm Trunnion mount shock.
All four Arrivals share the same front triangle. This presents some limitations in terms of optimizing frame geometry for all applications.
For these reasons, and given the A170 gets uphill quite efficiently but is a hoot on the way down, I didn't expect to really enjoy the A130. If I want a short travel bike, I'll generally reach for my hardtail. But I'm not too fussed about weight however - I haven't had any of the Arrival builds near a scale - and we ended up getting along quite famously, including on some trails I didn't enjoy on the longer travel A152.
Where the Arrival A152 wants to hurtle me forward at 88 miles an hour every time I let go of the brakes, but without the control of the A170, I find the A130 to be a much more predictable, if more cautious, descending bike. It's not trying to launch me back to the future in every tight and janky North Shore corner. It's not more forgiving in terms of wheel travel, but it is more forgiving in terms of rider errors. And I make lots of them.
Is this a photo of an A130 or an A140? It depends on whether that's a 50mm or 55mm stroke shock.
With most shocks, you'd never know the difference but SRAM prints the stroke and sag gradients.
For anyone who finds themselves over-forking their A130, it's still relatively inexpensive to swap from 55mm to 50mm stroke with a service.
Skip to the Game Of Forks I've been playing and I discovered that, both in terms of the suspension balance descending and in terms of the improved climbing position, thanks to a slacker STA, the Arrival combination for me is the A130 sporting the 160mm Lyrik from the A152. This machine climbs like no bike I've ever ridden; infinite traction, but at the same time, unlike other soggy machines that can claim the same, the upright poise and forward pep of the most efficient XC rigs.
I'm not claiming it's a lightweight 'Down Country' rocket ship like the Forekaster-equipped Rocky Mountain Element and I certainly skipped uphill faster on the Rekon-equipped Lux Trail, but for an all-day uphill grinder, the sit-and-spin or stand-and-strain, technical climbing chops of the A130 are excellent.
The A130, paired with Manitou's 140mm Mattoc, makes for an excellent trail bike, but for the shorter travel option, I usually reach for my hardtail.
I prefer the seat tube angle of the A130 over-forked, which is what prompted We Are One to suggest trying the over-shocked A140 setup.
The A170 performs as advertised. I'll be back with a comparison between it and the A140 with a coil shock. Both with beefier tires.
Not to take away from your climbing ability, but that bike goes up like fucking silk" - Mark S
We Actually Are One
That would be the end of the story, with my jumping back on the A170 build for the coming fall and winter season but Dustin from We Are One sent me a note saying, if I like the over-forked A130 I should really try the off-menu A140 build. I already had the parts, since it's simply combining the A130 linkage kit with the shock off the A152. That is, going from a 50mm stroke shock to a 55mm stroke shock.
It doesn't sound like much. I kept the same sag in millimetres - not the same sag percentage - from my A130 setup. Climbing the bike feels identical in terms of ride height, pedaling efficiency, and traction. This has me running approximately 22% sag on the A140. I rarely find the bottom but when I do, I always know I earned it, and it's only a light kiss.
I love to pedal the A130/A140 up relentless old service roads with a mix of the loosest loose sections, wandering baby heads, and awkward up-rock power moves. I also love my friends' reactions when I pull off something special. Finding traction where they can't or cranking up a technical move.
The A130 (A140), A152, and A170 are separated only by the paired links and the length of the Trunnion bolts. Riders may not be regularly changing configurations, but it's a nice spot of future-proofing. (Image: We Are One)
There's something magically balanced about descending on the 160mm front and 140mm rear suspension of the A140 setup. This probably sounds dumb to most folks, but it's like riding my rigid bike in the way that the geometry is predictable in all situations. It doesn't smash like the A170, but it smashes enough for a bike that's fun to climb.
It's bizarre to me how much differently the A140 and A152 ride even with the same shock, fork, tires, and brakes. It's not that I can't get the A140 moving fast, it simply doesn't spring forward with the same aggression when I pump on the pedals or land off a small drop, and I like that more cautious, controlled, application of speed. It tilts the bike a little closer to an 'every person' bike I suppose.
It usually takes me a long time to really fall in love with a mountain bicycle, but all of a sudden the Arrival and I are storming up the steepest walls and tearing down the other side. And I'm not saying that as I normally do, comparing my performance to myself. I've had multiple friends mention how much faster I am on this bike than they've ever seen me, up and down. The only problem is, they've seen me ride enough that they know the bike is a factor. As my friend Mark exclaimed, "Not to take away from your climbing ability, but that bike goes up like fucking silk."
With both the Lyrik-equipped A140 and Zeb-equipped A170 I've settled on an SQLab 30X bar in their highest rise. Cut to 770mm wide.
I'm also running a 50mm stem with both setups combined with the -16° handlebar. Relative to the bottom bracket height, I run the bar higher on the A170.
Setup Stuff
Over-forked, the seat tube angle works well for me, and the answer to the Arrival's short headtube - 100mm on this size large - has been to play with headset spacers and higher rise bars to find my sweet spot. The combination of over-forking and spacers under the stem reduces the reach some though. While on paper a 484mm Reach is a bit long for my T-Rex arms, I'm quite happy with the final fit. Likewise, the 472mm Reach number on the large Arrival A170 makes it easy to adjust to my happy place.
I properly ate shit the other day on a rock roll I've ridden a pile of times. I'm not certain what percentage of the crash I'd assign to rider error, changing conditions, or over-inflated MaxxTerra tires, but I felt very lucky to sit up in the roots and rocks at the bottom and realize I was relatively unscathed. The bike was fine too.
It was the last prompting I needed to convince me to swap out the rubber as I pedal into fall comparing a coil-sprung A140 with the A170 build.
I've spoken with riders who figure their next bike won't need exit ports for shifter or dropper post cables. I hope they stick around.
I've also spoken to some riders who want the option to mullet their next rig. And, recently two of my friends mentioned wishing there was a dual 27" Arrival option.
A blank slate with a 44/56 headtube. The Arrival frame is rated up to a 190mm fork, so by over-forking or running an extended lower cup, a dual 27" Arrival is possible.
More Build Notes
I can't tell any difference between the We Are One Convergence rims I'm riding and the previous generation hoops. The wheels are stiff, but not obtrusively so while I'm riding, they've stayed true and tensioned, they look sweet and they're made in Kamloops. All good things.
I love the response when I step on the pedals and the bike goes forward instantly. A perfect pairing of We Are One's efficient suspension and the near-instant, and totally solid, engagement of the Hydra hub. I know it's a personal preference, but fast-engaging hubs are my jam.
DTFHFG? I regularly find myself daydreaming of a five-speed CTDR+ drivetrain for the Arrival and the beautiful chainlines it would deliver.
Instead of twelve cogs, I imagine four steel cogs for Climb, Trail, Descend, and Road plus a replaceable aluminum bailout gear for long days and heinous pitches.
The A130/A140 pedal so well that with a 32t ring and 29" rear wheel I nearly never have cause to hit the low-low gear. So I think my SRAM CTDR+ cassette would be 10t, 20t, 30t, 40t, 50t and then I'd run a 34t up front.
Also on the setup notes, GX Transmission remains totally fine. I've had zero issues with dead batteries, because I check them after every ride and throw them in the charger if the indicators are red rather than green, and I haven't had issues with performance on the trail either. The derailleur has had its large-and-charged body smashed plenty of times and, thus far, all the wounds are cosmetic.
If this was my bike the first thing I'd change after tires would be to throw off the bonds of batteries and go forward with a cable drivetrain and dropper post. I'd probably go 1cm longer on the dropper, from 170mm to 180mm, at the same time. After that, I'd save up for a rear hoop to mullet it. Now that I'm used to riding mixed-wheel size setups, that 29" rear wheel makes itself known a bit too often and abruptly on the steepest technical trail transitions.
The Arrival A140 can go uphill hard, but it also likes lazier hike-a-bike and explore-away days. I feel this 140mm rear and 160mm front is the sweet spot for a do-anything-and-everything full suspension bike.
Previews
One bike I didn't love, the Arrival A152, has become four bikes I'm trying to keep straight. I'm not here to tell anyone what to do, let alone We Are One, but given that the Arrival will never be lithe compared to a dedicated shorter travel chassis, and given how rad it is as a 140mm bike, I think in their shoes I'd shrink my lineup to two bikes. The A170 is for folks who want a dedicated Enduro rig with trail chops. The A140 is for folks who want the best climbing but still legit descending longer-travel trail bike they can put their paws on.
The neat news, given the adaptability of the Arrival chassis, is that for folks who already own an A152 and find themselves less than thrilled; it's just a pair of links to experience the A140 setup. Keeping the stock 160mm fork and 55mm stroke shock, make it a much less expensive experiment than bumping up to the A170.
The A140 is the Arrival I'd own living almost anywhere and I'm going to see how far that versatility can go in the big-bike direction, relative to the A170, by beefing up tires and swapping out to a coil rear shock. At the same time, for winter on the North Shore, I'm excited to be putting hours on the longer-travel, Zeb-equipped, A170 package again. My next installment will feature those two bikes.
Height - Steve Buscemi-ish
Wait - Patiently
Ape Index - T-Rex
Age - The same as DOS
Favourite Trail(s) every week - Pipeline (thank you Ken!) to Lower Crippler (thank you Andy!)
Favourite Song(s) this week - I'm Your Man. Nick Cave (covering Leonard Cohen)
Favourite Colour - Cosmic Lilac
Bar Width - It depends
Reach & Stack & ETT - It depends
Crank Length - 175mm except when it's 170mm
Wheel Size - Hot For Mullets
Comments
Velocipedestrian
7 months, 2 weeks ago
How smoothly did the headset cup go in?
It looks slightly oversized.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
That’s my new ‘press’ tool. I just thwack the headset cup a bunch of times until it’s in and then fill it up with coffee for my break.
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Velocipedestrian
7 months, 2 weeks ago
'French press'.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
HAHAHAHA. So bad; so good. Roasted my brain thinking of a puny reply, but I have nothing.
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Carlos Matutes
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Yeah, it's a real grind.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I’ve been percolating ideas for over 7hrs and I’m more than little bitter I still don’t have any strong puns to contribute.
Velocipedestrian
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I'm sure if you brew a little longer you'll extract something.
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We_Are_One_Composites
7 months, 2 weeks ago
This is a really pressing issue. One could say a tighter response time would be more fitting and bearing the tolerance of all the people on here, we would hope you could insert something nice.
WalrusRider
7 months, 2 weeks ago
The only thing holding me back from getting an Arrival is the extremely low stack on the XL frame. My current bike has 25mm higher stack plus I'm already running a 40mm rise bar and 10 mm of spacers under the stem.
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handsomedan
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Same here, 6’3” long torso. Need more stack.
Also, super boost rear and trunnion mount shock…
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I will say this is one of two Trunnion frames - or at least one of two specific examples of Trunnion frames - that I would have no problem owing. The other being the Banshee Titan I reviewed.
I’m a Trunnion hater, but it can be well executed and would not dissuade me in those two cases.
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tdc_worm
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Agreed. I feel like specialized started this with their "S" sizing that allows riders to size up by keeping head tubes and the resultant stack heights super short. It completely penalizes larger riders. On our appropriate sized frames (i.e. XLs) we have to add a ridiculous amount of spacers (which shortens effective reach and effective top tube) and riser bars in order to get our hands high enough to not drop our torsos forward and over the bars when in the attack position. The only brand not doing this, currently, is Santa Cruz, who has elected to leave the XLs for the XL folks with HTs of 145mm on most models.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Fit Before Fashion, there are always 3" riser bars?!
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handsomedan
7 months, 2 weeks ago
That’d be great if these were offered in 12, 14 or 16 degrees backsweep…
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I wish ProTaper offered more sweep options as well. I think 8 / 12 / 16 is the magic three.
There's always DOOM or another custom bar manufacturer.
fartymarty
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Dan- Ergotec 70mm rise x 12 degree backsweep are what you need.
Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
It’s especially curious as Da Package only goes up to a 35mm rise.
That said I’d run my bar much lower if I lived in Kamloops, so with Reach/Stack I always consider local flavour.
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Velocipedestrian
7 months, 2 weeks ago
The 140 sounds like a great option, I share your hesitance with bikes that demand speed to feel good (I'm slow), and am a bit wary of More Travel due to the way it can get me in over my head.
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fartymarty
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I'm in the same boat. 140 is more than enough to get me into lots of trouble. Any more travel travel and the risk goes up sustantially wrt reward. This is one reason I have been enjoying riding the HT again - it can still be pushed but speeds are slower.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
For most places, a well-balanced 160/140 bike is probably the unicorn bike.
"I properly ate shit the other day on a rock roll I've ridden a pile of times. I'm not certain what percentage of the crash I'd assign to rider error, changing conditions, or over-inflated MaxxTerra tires, but I felt very lucky to sit up in the roots and rocks at the bottom and realize I was relatively unscathed. The bike was fine too."
This section was steep enough that it really came down to fork setting and tire option (and rider error). I certainly don't think an extra cm of Zeb would have saved me over the 160mm Lyrik. But, I can't help but wonder if the more confident way that I push the 170mm through technical sections would have been the difference maker.
Sometimes more travel does help pay the bills. And, of course, sometimes it adds to them.
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fartymarty
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Andrew - did you (or are you planning on) trying a 150mm fork? I've run my Murmur at 120/120, 140/140, 160/140, 170/140 and are currently at 150/140. Whilst I like 160/140 the shorter travel 150 fork feels a little sportier yet not as overwhelmed as 140/140 when things get chunky.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
This speaks to the challenge of this project Marty, when is enough enough? There are piles of different things I'd love to try with the Arrival before giving it back that I won't have an opportunity to set up. Chief among them is a mullet setup. But I would also LOVE to try a 190mm fork on the 170 setup just to try it.
I discovered (fairly late) last night prepping the bike to ride today that the coil shock I have for the 140/152 setup doesn't clear the downtube (thankfully I took the time to mount it without a spring or this review would be over-over today). So already the box has closed a little bit. But that's all good, it has to end somewhere.
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Running the Manitou Mattoc (140) which stands up high in its travel and is simply the nicest riding fork I've ridden in... even compared to the Mezzer and R7, on the Arrival 130 and also riding the 160mm Lyrik on both the A130 and A140, with various amounts of sag, I think that I'd prefer the 160/140 setup, but I'm not going to know for certain and it's so which-fork dependent.
With IRT and low sag (made possible by just how smooth it is), the 140mm Mattoc is standing as high as the 160mm Lyrik when it's come to smash time anyway.
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fartymarty
7 months, 2 weeks ago
You could be fettling this bike till the cows come home with different setups. This speaks volumes about it's versatility - something that is very much missing from most FS bikes. Shame it's not a long term project.
Good point on being fork dependent but also terrain dependent. I can see 160/140 would be awesome on the shore.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I mean, how long term is long term? I’ve ridden/written quite a bit about this rig.
Super Boost is the one thing that kills me a bit as it prevented me from experiencing the bike as a mullet. It’s a rocket as a dual 29” but on some of the steep janky stuff I like I get kissed by the rear tire a bit too often - especially being used to mullets. I’m only 5’9” so it makes sense.
But yeah, not to give away the sequel but I think the Arrival is one of the most fantastic bike nerd bikes on the market. Which is not to say it isn’t a grand option for non-nerd riders too.
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fartymarty
7 months, 2 weeks ago
How long is long term... a very good question - for me to get to grips with a bike usually takes a year but YMMV.
You (and NSMB) have probably written more about this bike than all other sites combined. But it does seem like a bike that's actually worthy.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
No, it takes me a lot of rides to make a bike feel like 'mine' and that's especially true with full suspension and especially-especially true with longer travel rigs where damping is so trail or feature-specific and I'm trying to get it boiled down to a single set of settings.
It's just where diminishing returns kick in that becomes a question. I'll be on the bike for a little while yet. We Are One has been very supportive of this project (supplying multiple forks, shocks, linkage sets, etc.) and I think what's neatest about that is that my initial review of the A152 was very cautious of endorsement.
kamloops_rider
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I liked my stock A130 but didn’t really love it. However, that all changed when I went to the A140 setup. Currently setup with a 160mm Mezzer upfront and the new Rockshox coil in the back (~192lbs with a 600lb spring). It’s a bit heavier but climbs just as well and descends great - I set some new records for myself even.
Very curious about trying the A170 setup though so looking forward to your thoughts on the next installment!
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Thank you for the vindication. It doesn't make sense how much I love the A140 compared to the A152 and even the A130. Compared to the A152, I mean, slightly different kinematics can explain it, but compared to the A130 the only thing that separates the two setups is 5mm of shock stroke.
I found out late last night that my 185x55 coil shock doesn't clear the downtube (a good reminder to always test clearance without air pressure/without a spring when trying these things) so I'll have to envy your A140 coil experience. I do think, from riding bikes I've been wrenching on, that the Arrival should be sold as a coil bike in any travel setup so that's going to have me on the A170 ASAP now that sketchy season is set to arrive.
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Lu Kz
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Your problem could be solved if you do what one of the engineers did when testing an ultra-long travel coil setup: just cut a little hole in the downtube for clearance.
How's that for confidence in your product?
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
HAHAHAHA. Then just cover it with some Gorilla Tape when I give it back and whistle as I stroll away casually?
I hadn't heard that story - that's crazy, but like you say - it exudes confidence.
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Vladimir Adzhigirey
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Do you think 140 rear 170 front might work with the stem slammed? I have a 130 link lying around and been running 152/170. Would be fun to try a sprightlier setup.
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Velocipedestrian
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Try it and tell us. I played around with 170/140 on my old Spitfire.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
"Try it and tell us."
Always the best response!
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I have run the Zeb on the A140 and I thought it was rad. Keep in mind I come from riding a lot of different hardtails (this year I've ridden hardtails with 0-170mm of travel) but I think balanced amounts of travel are significantly over-rated, especially on steep terrain where forks sag a lot more.
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Moritz Haager
7 months, 2 weeks ago
That drivetrain looks a bit dirtier than I’d expect from you Mr.Major ;-)
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Any rig I’m riding gets the chain wiped after every ride and fresh lube when needed. But I very rarely hose/clean bikes and I never use a chain cleaner so they most always look a bit trashed.
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olaa
7 months, 2 weeks ago
What are your thoughts on the Manitou, especially under braking?
I've got a Fox 34 on a new to me bike. I am positively surprised at how well i works in many situations but i had forgotten how bad that chassis handles braking on rougher trails. So i'm tempted to try a Mattoc if it gives me a better chassis.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I think we're going to see a bunch of reverse-arch forks coming to the world of XC racing (apparently the patent has expired), and then trail riding, in short order because of how stiff the chassis can be under twisting/braking for the same weight. The Mattoc is rad. Actually, never mind the Mattoc, the R7 AKA 'The Magic Toothpick' is exemplary in this regard with its 'tiny' 32mm stanchions.
Fox's reverse-arch forks XC forks have already been put to use in WC XC racing, and Brent Graves, the person at the top of Cane Creek, was involved in the first Manitou RA forks and recently wrote about it so I think it's safe to say they're playing with the concept.
Anyway, I'm always wary of spending other folks' money but given your specific complaint, I don't think you could buy a better XC/Trail/Mini-Enduro(?)... All Mountain fork than the Mattoc Pro.
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olaa
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I'll add another category then: Trail racing :) This bike is getting set up specifically for the Transvesubienne race in the south of France. It's an xc race with 2700m of climbing and 4500m descending over 80k, most of it on steep rocky and demanding trails. So the bike has to be light for all the climbing, and as well tackle descents that are well into the enduro category.
Sounds promising though, and interesting to hear that the reverse arch makes that much of a difference.
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Devin Zoller
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Okay- to put you on the spot, Mattoc or Mezzer? It'd be at 150mm travel, front of a V1 Druid that currently has a Fox 36 that I feel aggressively ambivalent about. I weigh 170 lbs kitted up and ride fairly steep stuff, 203mm rotors and Dominions required for confident stopping.
Would bumping the Mattoc to 150 make it too noodly vs the 36? Is the extra 300 grams + dropping travel on the Mezzer too stiff? Thoughts appreciated, and always look forward to your articles- keep up the good work!
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
@Devin, for that application I'd ride a lowered Mezzer. I do have a few pounds on you. The main reason, though, is that the Druid is at the short-travel end of what bikes of its capability sport. So, given that I tend to treat bikes like Lego, I'd rather have a fork that is capable of more travel than is sitting at its maximum.
I don't think the Mattoc at 150mm would feel noodly relative to the 36 in any plane but I've only ridden it at 140mm and shorter.
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Devin Zoller
7 months, 2 weeks ago
You’re the best. Thanks for the inpu
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Vik Banerjee
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I'm impressed by how many Arrivals I'm seeing out and about. For a small brand they are selling a fair amount of bikes in my neck of the woods. Not sure which travel version as I am not paying that much attention to the details, but the distinctive stealth fighter angles of the frame are hard to miss.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
It's a frame that certainly doesn't need decals to be identified. I get a weird feeling anytime I start talking about the relative value of 10K+ mountain bicycles but I do think for someone spending that kind of money the Arrival has some extra selling features included for 11,000 CAD.
I mean, specifically down to wheels, what other bike in that price range comes close?
With the stock builds I can always tell by the forks - A130/Pike, A152/Lyrik, A170/Zeb. Locally I've yet to see an A130.
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Lu Kz
7 months, 2 weeks ago
"It's a frame that certainly doesn't need decals to be identified"
It's pretty clear what "look" Dustin and the We Are One crew want from the Arrival (matte earthy tones and letting the product speak for itself as far as branding goes) but I have a bit of fantasy of getting an Arrival and then painting it in some bright, glossy colours with big decals in all the classic places.
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Mammal
7 months, 2 weeks ago
This one looks pretty nice.
https://www.vitalmtb.com/photos/members/we-are-one-composites-arrival-show-bikes
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Lu Kz
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Yeah, those look pretty nice, I remember seeing photos of those.
Not garish enough though for my tastes. My two current projects are Hawaiian shirt aurum HSP and pink-yellow neon fade gravel bike. I'd want the arrival to be very love/hate depending who sees it, haha.
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Mammal
7 months, 2 weeks ago
All-In. I can get behind that.
Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Like a lime green Porsche with PORSCHE written on it in giant letters down the side?
BarryW
7 months, 2 weeks ago
That purple one please!
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handsomedan
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Would love to see da package with more back sweep!
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Multiple sweep options would be great. The stem compatibility is an issue for me too though. I like to play around with stem length quite a bit and it’s a couple minute job with a four bolt clamp.
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fartymarty
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I completely get it. I'm a certified carboniphobe and I love it. It's a beautifully, carefully, smartly made frame by a company that gets it and it certainly doesn't need to be plastered with decals that detract from its beauty.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Aesthetically it is my favourite carbon frame by far.
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Ripbro
7 months, 2 weeks ago
How long does it take to swap out the links? Is this something you would consider if going on a trip outside of your usual terrain?
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I haven't timed myself, but at this point maybe 10 minutes to swap links/shock/fork.
I've been back-and-fourth on that question a million times. I'd also want to have a second set of wheels with faster tires - or more likely share two wheelsets between the Arrival and a hardtail, one with faster tires and one with winter-on-the-Shore tires.
But yeah, I'd choose to have an A170 if I could only have one setup. But I love riding the A140 here and I imagine I'd prefer it over the A170 in many places. It's way less money, and in my case also way less space, than having two super bikes and the swap is fast, so why not?
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Velocipedestrian
7 months, 2 weeks ago
So to your earlier complaint re: super boost - Arrival + Tyaughton?
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
The Tyaughton could be a logical choice for someone looking for a stock hardtail to accompany an Arrival.
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Frorider
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Btw as a long term Mezzer Pro fan I’m still blown away by how good my Mattoc Pro 140 is after a few weeks of owning/set up time.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I’m a fan of the Mezzer and R7, but the Mattoc is on another level (I used to say “this Mattoc is on another level” but that seems to be everyone’s experience that’s ridden it versus another Manitou).
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earle.b
7 months, 2 weeks ago
The positive comments on the Mattoc Pro has me wondering about a 140/120 lightweight weight weenie trail bike build. Just how light could I build a frame that wasn't a noodle....hmmm.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I’d still love to say some delicious crate suspension combo with the Lux Trail flex-stay rear. Custom steel front end with the geo I like, CCDB Inline shock, 140mm Mattoc fork. Looks so good in my head.
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roil
7 months, 2 weeks ago
DTFHFG? I certainly hope so.
I don't need 500% range, or at least, I'm willing to compromise a bit of flat land performance for less unsprung/rotational mass.
Mountain bikers love to focus on questionable weight savings (different grades of carbon fiber frame construction are particularly atrocious) yet these same riders are happy boast about running massive cassettes on the rear.
I dream of a high pivot bike with a TINY chainring (<20 tooth?) so I could pair it with a condensed set of small cogs in the rear.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Unfortunately, Transmission, unlike AXS, does not work for a DTFHFG build. There's currently no way to limit the derailleur's high/low range.
However, if SRAM does release a smaller range 7-speed DH version of T-Type it would be very possible to use that with the longer cage to put together a 7-spd build with a very nice chainline. The Arrival A140 pedals so well that even with a 32t ring I'm very rarely using 2nd gear and the aluminum low gear is as-new.
One of the things I'm most looking forward to in moving on from reviewing this bike is getting back to fun drivetrain shenanigans. Friction shifts and fewer gears for everyone.
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roil
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I am not sold on transmission. I don’t need a derailleur that can support my weight horizontally.
Do you see any potential issues with a high pivot + tiny chainring + cassette setup?
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Me neither.
I’m not a big believer in the HP+I movement, but don’t foresee any issues at all with the possible exception of ensuring enough chain wrap around the ring (less teeth engaged on the smaller ring). But that’s easy to solve by also running a chain guide.
Some suspension designs are quite ring-size agnostic. I happily ran 26t and 28t rings on the Banshee Titan with an 11-36t cassette. What size ring were you thinking?
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roil
7 months, 2 weeks ago
The appeal of the HP bike is that the suspension characteristics are no longer tied to the chainring's position/size. You should be able to run any size changing (ignoring wrap and efficiency issues) with no ill effects.
With this in mind, the chainring size is really dependent on the smallest and lightest cassette I could run for my use case. I haven't pencilled it out yet. I would like to borrow an AXS derailleur for a couple of weeks and track my gear usage.
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Cooper Quinn
7 months, 2 weeks ago
This is a neat AXS feature that is fun to check.
Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
@Cooper, yes it is… haha
Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
@roil, 100% a feature of HP+I. My only thought with referencing the Titan was to point out that there are also non-HP+I bikes that are not suboptimal with small rings.
There are so many questions to answer in terms of how many gears you’ll use, what cassette spacing - what drivetrain. And how big a jump you can handle.
My 28x11-36 was an 8-speed, but based on a 10-spd spacing with two cogs removed. It had some big jumps and no ‘bailout’ low gear option.
If it was possible with current rear derailleurs I’d be happy with something like an 11/22/33/44 with a 30t.
Using smaller low gears a smaller ring makes sense though. We gained a massive amount of ground clearance and shed a ton of weight on my daughter’s rig running a 24x11-34 instead of the stock gearing (30x11-46) and she never wants for a harder gear.
roil
7 months, 2 weeks ago
@andrew major
24x11-34 sounds pretty good to me. How many gears in that cassette? I’m not opposed to bigger jumps between gears, especially between the taller gears where effort is lower.
Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
@Roil, my daughter's cassette has 9 cogs (it's a 10-speed cassette with one cog removed). 10-speed cassette spacing is the magic behind getting the best shifting experience from a SRAM 9-speed shifter and Shimano Zee 10/11-speed derailleur. With the clutch de-tuned just-so it's actually my favourite drivetrain of all time.
Joseph Crabtree
7 months, 2 weeks ago
How did you get on with the relatively low BB on the tech climbs? My 120mm XCish bike is at about the same as this but my 150mm bike needs at least 345mm or so to pedal through the chunky bits.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I love it. I ratchet a lot climbing though - which I think comes from all single speeding - so combined with the Hydra hub and good timing I get up all kinds of chunky sections sans drama.
It also helps that the bikes run relatively low sag and really stand up in their travel.
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dirtnerd
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I had no idea you could go to 140 in the rear without changing links. Your article has me excited to switch up my WAO to the 160/140 setup. 140 up front is not enough for me either.
Thanks Andrew.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Cheers! Depending on what shock you are running you may not even need to but a new one. Many shocks only need a spacer removed to convert from 50mm stroke to 55mm stroke.
I quite enjoyed the A130 with the 140mm Mattoc (Mattoc is awesome) but the 160/140 suites my riding much better. Enjoy and follow up here to let me know how it goes.
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Frorider
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Informative review as always. TBH I’m not understanding the “as rear travel decreases, effective seat tube angles should get slacker if for no other reason than to maintain pedaling position since they'll have less sag” reasoning. All my suspension frames are paired with a suspended (non rigid) fork that sags, which means the sagged SA isn’t much different than static SA?
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Climbing bikes sit more into their travel (sag more in the rear) and it results in a much larger difference in the STA Vs. the static geometry climbing a bike like an A170 Vs. a bike like an A130.
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Onawalk
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Well shoot,
I've been waiting on the review of the A130 for some time, and its not exactly what I wanted to read. I guess deep down I knew that a bike built with so much "adaptability" was going to be chock full of compromise.
Its a shame you dont have the time/resources to test it out in all its different guises, but I was likely wanting it to be too much for too many things.
I have a 170 bike, Spire, and if I'm honest, its one of the best bikes I've ever had. It opens up terrain and options like nothing else. The issue is, it feels like a lot of bike when in mellower terrain, or with more mellow friends. So the case for a competent short travel bike, to make the world right again....
Maybe I'll get a chance to try one out to see for myself, but until then, I think a 275 wheel on my short travel Fugitive is worth a try....
Great series of write ups, I have really enjoyed them
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
So keep in mind I’m one rider/writer, in one specific zone, who even in that zone has a preference for trains that differs from many others.
But yeah, I think in that Element and Spur travel range a purpose build XC/Trail frame makes more sense, where the 140/160 build is a perfect example of the frames versatility.
Almost as much as I’d love to try it mullet, I’d love to try it as a 170/190. Just to try it. But I was never going to be able to flip every stone so I’d like to think this has been a thorough, if incomplete, series.
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Onawalk
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Oh, I hope my comment wasnt taken as anything other than appreciative of the work you put in both to flip the bikes around, and write a good review.
Its all excellent.
I wanted this bike to be an absolute groundbreaking standout for what I wanted, be damed what anyone else wanted, but I just dont think it is.
Again, I think I was hoping the bike was going to be more than it could ever be. In reality, its a bike that can change shape to meet different peoples needs, but not likely to meet the different needs of a single individual (not sure that makes a tonne of sense, but at least I get it...)
Anything that tries to be more than one thing, usually ends up being too much of a compromise of all the things. A generalist is never going to be as good as a specialist...
In reality, I might just need to learn to weld properly, and build the bike I think I want. Lots come close, but my parameters might be too specific.
Side note, my 160/140 Sentinel was an excellent bike, really really good. Maybe that travel bracket just works well in the type of trails we like to ride
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Pete Roggeman
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Love my 160/150 Sentinel. I had the prior version too and it was good at 140mm but the 150 is better - haven't even put a 170mm fork on it and it's great on all but the nastiest stuff. I consider it a burly trail bike rather than a lighter duty Enduro bike, but whatever label you want to use, it's one of my all time faves.
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Flatted-again
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Gonna chime in that the v1 sentinel with a cascade link and a 170mm fork feels really balanced, can climb anything techy I point it up, and still hold its own at the Southwest’s north shore (Pajarito bike park). I did some back of the envelope maths and 160/140 or 170/146 with a 64* headtube up being pretty similar in vertical travel between the front and rear.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
"and still hold its own"
This statement is almost cliché at this point in referring to any bike from the last 5-6 years.
Flatted-again
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Ain't it great? It's a pretty compliant turn of phrase. But to your point, yes, we're in a great time of good bikes, and I meant to add to the conversation about the goodness of longer front travel/near 140mm travel setup. Any more and it seems climbing suffers; any less and I suffer
Onawalk
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Confirmed,
I had the Cascade link on my V1, but left the fork at 160. Bike was great, and I went back and fourth on the Spire/Sentinel as an upgrade, eventually the Spire won out
Bikes can be so friggin fun!
Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
@Flatted-again
"I meant to add to the conversation about the goodness of longer front travel/near 140mm travel setup"
Totally understood and appreciated. I think it's something a lot of folks need to hear before buying their next bike. If in doubt a 150/140 or 160/140 rig owns the category of 'mountain bike.'
Skooks
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I'm really liking my Fugitive 138 with a 160mm fork. I've contemplated a smaller rear wheel but haven't given it a proper try. love to hear your thoughts if you do mullet your Fug.
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Onawalk
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Current plan for the Fugitive is to do a 275 rear wheel, with the 120R/140F see how I like it. I figure putting it in the High position should offset the 275 rear wheel.
Its a fun bike, and was very capable in the 140/160 setup, but was looking for a rowdy short travel bike.
I'll do my best to comment if I end up swapping the rear wheel
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Dave Smith
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I admit to being curious about the 170 with 170 links but I haven't found that I've run out of bike too often on my 152/160 setup. After swapping out the x2 I've found it so well composed on the steady diet of bomb holes and thunder chunk that I feed my Arrival on daily basis. I like that responsive feel when I let off the brakes you weren't able to get along with so haven't felt the need to dip into my wallet for the links, fork, shock etc etc.
BTW I ran an Evil Offering in 140x140, 140x150 and eventually settled on 140x160 and found that I was a bit under gunned at times in my neck of the woods. It was more playful but it was pretty skittish on steeps and I was getting kicked off lines on a regular basis when the speed ramped up.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
The one thing I’d say is if you have the chance to try your current setup (185x55 shock and 160mm fork) with the A130 link plates then take it and report back. Not so much about losing a centimetre of travel, but I think the suspension works better with the A140 than the A152 and would be interested in what you think.
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Dave Smith
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Happy to do that at some point.
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JD
7 months ago
I'm about to do this... I've been sitting on the 130mm link all season, and while my initial thought was to wait until the end of the season and go full A130 mode with a 140 fork, I think I'll try this first.
I don't think you explicitly talked about geometry change for 140/160. I suspected, and I think I have since convinced myself by running it through CAD and various geometry calculators, that the 130 link with the 160mm fork changes ONLY the leverage ratio, and preserves the rest of the geometry the same as the A152. The geometry differences of the stock A130 are then based solely on the shorter fork.
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Pete Roggeman
7 months, 2 weeks ago
You've been....Thunder-CHUNKED
Duh, duh, duh-duh duh-duh DUHHHH
Thunder-CHUNKED....
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Dave Smith
7 months, 2 weeks ago
There was no help, no help from you - thunder!
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dirtnerd
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Hey Andrew, what did you use to plug the cable ports and did you plug the bottom also?
Thanks, great article.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Thank you. The exit plugs near the head tube came as spec from We Are One as this bike originally shipped with X0 AXS.
I didn't plug the exit at the BB.
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ClydeRide
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I so want to do a shootout of the A140 with a Pivot Switchblade and a Knolly Fugitive 138.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Interesting. Other than having Super Boost 157 rear hub spacing and similar amounts of travel, I wouldn't have thought of those three bikes as having the same target customer. You'd be interested in a shoutout in terms of having an interest in buying any of those three bikes and you'd be curious to read a comparison?
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ClydeRide
7 months, 1 week ago
I currently ride a Switchblade v2 and I am the target customer. :-)
I’d love to shoot them out myself (though I’m not sure I can swing that). Or I’d love to read about it. Either way.
I’m a large-ish (6-3 215lb) 1-bike guy that rides a lot of different stuff all over the left half of the continent. These all feel like a bike for that.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 1 week ago
Oh, totally agree they're all a similarly suitable 1-bike solution (with the Arrival scoring bonus points for the Lego factor), I just wouldn't have imagined the three of them appealing to the same rider such that they'd be choosing between them.
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kekoa
7 months, 2 weeks ago
I’m sorry. Late to the review. Andrew- really enjoyed reading this. Was idly thinking of this platform because it’s so bad assed and I love the made in Canada ethos. Was underwhelmed when the complete 130 was released and I’m not riding often enough or hard enough to warrant such a nice bike so ended up with something else.
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Andrew Major
7 months, 2 weeks ago
Cheers! I'm glad you enjoyed it and I've certainly been enjoying the experience. The Arrival is a rare case of me testing something I wouldn't consider buying (it's more money than I'd spend on a mountain bike) but I also see the value in it over most every other super-bikes for folks who can/will drop the cash. It's such a compelling machine.
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4everkidd
7 months, 1 week ago
Love the unbiased no BS reviews on this site. I picked up a limited edition Arrival 152 in August and haven't looked back. This is the best sled i've ridden to date and is replacing an Evil Offering v2 with 160mm fork, Yeti SB165, Pivot Firebird and switchblade, and Evil Calling. The stack hasn't been too much of an issue, although a 45mm rise from WAO would be a nice option. I've yet to use up all 152mm of travel in the rear but it somehow never feels harsh so I think your 140/160 setup may be the ticket for me and finally finding the one bike quiver i've been searching for. Only change i've made to the build was a gloss ride wrap, green lyrik, and RaceFace Era cranks with oval 30tooth chainring
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