Wine Me Dine Me 29 Me! - REDUX
29ers VS. The Shore
Words by Mark Wood. Photos by Mark Wood.
Date: 2011-12-30
* This article was originally published in October 2011. The 29er momentum doesn't seem to be slowing down, even in the most unlikely place—the slow-tech of the North Shore. Here's Mark Wood's take on some of the forerunners of the big wheel here on the Shore.
Arthur Gaillot descends through the chunky rock faces on Skull supervised by an approving Piper
As the 29er craze continues to seemingly sweep the nation, the North Shore may be the last hold out to big wheel fever. Although their numbers are on the increase they are still an oddity here on the Shore. As the amount of converts seemingly grows everywhere else but here, there are a few hardcore mavericks taking up the charge, daring to push the limits of their oversized wagon wheelers and testing their capabilities on the North Shore gnarl.
Arthur Gaillot leads Kim Steed to the promised land where everything is 29 inches around.
“Drink the kool aid,” beckons Brian McCurdy, long time 29er rider. He’s been riding the Shore for several years on his quiver of Niners, which includes a carbon single speed. Trading in his Banshee Scream so many years ago, leaving shuttles behind for good, he’s a born again XC masochist. Brian rides throughout Squamish, Pemberton and the Chilcotins, favouring epics and long climbs - perfect territory for a 29er. Living at the foot of Mount Seymour, McCurdy frequents Bridal Path and its offshoots. On a dry summer day, I follow McCurdy up steep, techy climbs like Bridal under Cardiac. He shoots up like a missile, due in part to his stovepipe quads, but the big wheels certainly help. The advantages are immediately evident the first time you ride a 29er. The wheels seem to turn on their own momentum, even if it takes a bit more muscle to get them rolling. Rolling easily over obstacles, their extra diameter is better able to span holes, making it easier to keep your speed, excelling especially on climbs. But how do they fare on tight, technical descents when the going gets rough?
Brian McCurdy is a long time Niner convert.
Kim Steed is pushing the limits on his Santa Cruz Tallboy. You can find old footage of Steed clipped in, hopping over A Frames and platform drops in the early NSX films and he’s still going hard after all these years. A great all round rider, he’s as competent on steep and gnarly terrain as he is pushing the pedals on a big XC loop. Despite the mere 4 inches of travel on his Tallboy, I watch Steed tackle steep chutes with harsh transitions, the big wheels creating what the proponents refer to as a “favourable angle of attack.” Essentially the big wheel lessens harsh transitions because it is further out in front. Steed genuinely looks like he’s having fun on our early morning rip, even throwing in a 360 pirouette as we exit the tasty double black trail, proving it’s a nimble machine in the right hands. This may be the essential part of the equation; your success on a 29er may just depend on the quality of the pilot, as will any ride.
Gaillot tackles Skull on a misty morning , clouds in the sky.
The lack of travel available in the world of 29ers is a point of trepidation here on the Shore where “6 inches minimum” is the mantra of most. But that’s changing. Take the 5.5” Intense Tracer 2 or the 5.5” travel Niner WFO for instance. And now there’s a handful of other 5” offerings like the Norco Shinobi and the Specialized Stumpjumper. Fox now has a 140mm 29er fork to counter the Rock Shox Reba and Marzochhi’s buttery smooth 44. Tire selection is on the increase too so options are beginning to open up. No major manufacturer has broken the 6” mark on rear travel however, despite prototype testing of bigger travel 29er DH rigs. Wheel clearance is a design challenge as the larger wheels cycle through their travel. It may be difficult if not impossible to overcome without obtrusively lengthening the wheelbase, already a bone of contention for some.
Kim Steed hits a tasty rock chute.
Another North Shore rider who is a devout convert is Arthur Gaillot of Suspension Therapy. Arthur is a consistent top finisher in the local Super D series, trading off podium firsts with Chris Johnston, who rides a 26er, ensuring the debate's survival. Gaillot pushes the envelope both up and down He hits class 5 features with his 4” travel Santa Cruz Tall Boy such as the Pile Driver on Boogieman, a 10 foot platform drop. He’s also ridden the nasty, high consequence rock faces off the beaten track. But like someone said to me “Gaillot could take a washing machine down the mountain.” True enough, a good rider can make any bike roll, but he’s proving a 29er is no handicap. Fit and fierce, Gaillot can climb to Pipeline from the Fromme gate in an amazing 12 minutes (albeit seeing stars). Arthur can make the big bike do what he wants. Like Wade Simmons repetitively hitting the Loonie drop on his Rocky Mountain Altitude 29er, a good rider can handle anything.
Arthur proves you don’t need a 50 lb shuttle bike to take on the North Shore gnar.
“It's like carving on powder skis,” Gaillot demonstrates, leaning the bike in front of me, making long sweeping carves in the dirt. Drifting is a stable venture with the wide contact patch, you just need to have the courage to lean into it and the rubber hooks up predictably. The big wheels are noticeably stable on fast, wide-open descents, but require a bit more time to coerce round corners in the slow, tight technical trails. Unless you’re Andreas Hestler that is.
Brian McCurdy is a powerhouse on the Shore XC.
I struggle to keep up with Hestler and Simmons on the far side of Seymour as they gobble up vertical through root-strewn terrain on their Rocky Mountain Altitude 29ers. I ask Dre for his thoughts. “They’re just different,” was all he could offer as I watched him easily pivot his back wheel round tight corners. If you’ve got the advanced skills, you can adapt to anything.
The more roots the merrier for Jerry Willows.
Going steep and deep on a regular basis, team nsmb.com rider Jerry Willows is pushing the limits of his 5 inch Specialized Stumpjumper 29. Tail Willows and it seems there’s no trade off even on gnarly terrain. He’s charging as fast downhill as anyone on a 6 inch all mountain 26er, most often faster. Plus, he’s leading on the climbs. Willows is riding classic, techy Shore terrain that challenges even big bikes and doing it as fast and smooth as anyone on any bike.
Arthur and his faithful training partner Piper. Behind every good man, is a great dog.
As the options for 29ers expand their appeal is finally turning heads on the Shore. The big wheel machines are a growing segment of the market and manufacturers are directing their efforts to capitalize. In 2012 for instance all hardtail Rocky Mountain Bikes will be 29ers. As Pat Mulrooney, local Norco rep states “You can’t even find a 26inch wheel on the salesroom floor in the States anymore.” Hyperbole? There’s plenty of hype, and depending on who you talk to these bikes seem to be living up to it. They eat up the miles, climb like a monkey and offer a favourable angle of attack. This helps prevent ass over tea kettle falls and takes the edge off bony bits.
Steed and his Tallboy gobble up the eroded, chunky terrain of the Shore.
Big wheelers might just be the answer for noobs in the sport. And for the advanced rider, the big wheels are a force to be reckoned with, no matter what the terrain. But as with all things there are tradeoffs. Slow turning, some complain they aren’t as nimble as a 26 inch wheeled bike through the tight and twisty. Limited accessory choices and depth of travel may be enough for riders to pass on the conversion. For that ‘one bike’ owner, it’s going to be dependent on how you ride, what you ride, where you ride and of course, what skills you bring to the table. As some formidable riders attempt to find their limitations here on the Shore, there appear to be few as long as the pilot is up to the challenge. There are fanatics out there, and we all know at least one by now, who won’t touch anything under 29 inches. So why all the hype? Mark Furlong, long time Shore shredder, gives some perspective; “If we were all riding 29ers and someone came out with a 26er, what do you think everyone would be saying?”
It doesn’t matter what Willows rides, the pace is always fast.
What side of this debate do you sit on? I for one don't want to like 29ers because I don't want fall out of love with my 26ers. Choose your team below...
Comments
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Posted by morgman at 12:14 AM on 10-31-2011
Great shots and some good laughs in there too.
http://www.nsmb.com/assets/2011/29/9...=430&width=700
Great shots and some good laughs in there too.
http://www.nsmb.com/assets/2011/29/9...=430&width=700
Posted by GladePlayboy at 07:19 AM on 10-31-2011
Unfortunately, the cross section of riders outlined here is very skewed toward the expert/pro category. Why not take a group of average Joes and put them through the ringer on 29ers on the Shore? That would provide results that might be more definitive and/or relative. Otherwise, its just trend jumping and marketing hype. Is Andreas Hestler or Wade Simmons going to slag a Rocky 29er? Doubtful.
Unfortunately, the cross section of riders outlined here is very skewed toward the expert/pro category. Why not take a group of average Joes and put them through the ringer on 29ers on the Shore? That would provide results that might be more definitive and/or relative. Otherwise, its just trend jumping and marketing hype. Is Andreas Hestler or Wade Simmons going to slag a Rocky 29er? Doubtful.
Posted by gotham at 07:29 AM on 10-31-2011
I don't think 29ers are fit to be ridden by average Joes.
Or maybe if we buy a 29er then we will be able to keep up with the pros?
Quote:
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Originally Posted by GladePlayboy
(Post 2583456)
Unfortunately, the cross section of riders outlined here is very skewed toward the expert/pro category. Why not take a group of average Joes and put them through the ringer on 29ers on the Shore? That would provide results that might be more definitive and/or relative. Otherwise, its just trend jumping and marketing hype. Is Andreas Hestler or Wade Simmons going to slag a Rocky 29er? Doubtful.
|
Or maybe if we buy a 29er then we will be able to keep up with the pros?
Posted by the Master Plan Dan at 07:47 AM on 10-31-2011
Really? I have no idea where all this comes from. I ride Sebs borrowed 29er Tallboy, and I am by no means a pro. They may take a little more finess but only the amount that a riding a reqular xc bike would.
Throw your leg over one and give it a spin, you migh surprise yourself. I have watched die-hard haters fold.
I for one, am never going back. As the DH portion of my life fades, the advantages of 29ers are more and more appealing.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by gotham
(Post 2583457)
I don't think 29ers are fit to be ridden by average Joes.
Or maybe if we buy a 29er then we will be able to keep up with the pros? |
Throw your leg over one and give it a spin, you migh surprise yourself. I have watched die-hard haters fold.
I for one, am never going back. As the DH portion of my life fades, the advantages of 29ers are more and more appealing.
Posted by GladePlayboy at 07:59 AM on 10-31-2011
I must be having a mid-life crisis because I just came back to DH/FR bikes (at 43) after a 6 year absence... I must admit I find the 29er trend intriguing but I don't need to jump on the bandwagon to enjoy riding. Just get out there and give her and ride like its your last day.
I must be having a mid-life crisis because I just came back to DH/FR bikes (at 43) after a 6 year absence... I must admit I find the 29er trend intriguing but I don't need to jump on the bandwagon to enjoy riding. Just get out there and give her and ride like its your last day.
Posted by Guest at 08:29 AM on 10-31-2011
Found a good article on 29er tech from norco. Like the bit on head angles. http://www.norco.com/news/5209/rolling-forward-with-the-29-wheel/
Found a good article on 29er tech from norco. Like the bit on head angles. http://www.norco.com/news/5209/rolling-forward-with-the-29-wheel/
Posted by Oldfart at 09:17 AM on 10-31-2011
You and I both. I am not sure I can ride a dual suspension 29er yet because I am possibly too short. I'll try a Tall Boy one of these days though. I do have a Highball and I just fit. It slays Bridle Path and all the lower Seymour trails. And I have enjoyed riding it all over the less intimidating Fromme lines like Executioner, DW Lower Earlcan.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by the Master Plan Dan
(Post 2583459)
Really? I have no idea where all this comes from. I ride Sebs borrowed 29er Tallboy, and I am by no means a pro. They may take a little more finess but only the amount that a riding a reqular xc bike would.
Throw your leg over one and give it a spin, you migh surprise yourself. I have watched die-hard haters fold. I for one, am never going back. As the DH portion of my life fades, the advantages of 29ers are more and more appealing. |
Posted by nick at 09:19 AM on 10-31-2011
“If we were all riding 29ers and someone came out with a 26er, what do you think everyone would be saying?”
Most likely the same shit! ha! just ride you gearhore.
“If we were all riding 29ers and someone came out with a 26er, what do you think everyone would be saying?”
Most likely the same shit! ha! just ride you gearhore.
Posted by biggles604 at 09:26 AM on 10-31-2011
We need a story that just covers Arthur's socks!
29ers are pretty awesome. I've tried a couple now, and they are just so much fun. Until you've tried one, you won't understand.
We need a story that just covers Arthur's socks!
29ers are pretty awesome. I've tried a couple now, and they are just so much fun. Until you've tried one, you won't understand.
Posted by morgman at 09:37 AM on 10-31-2011
I rode the Scott Spark 26 and 29 back to back in Sun Valley, and there were times that both was better and/or more fun. Now I'm riding a 29er hardtail on the Shore and am quite surprised with its capabilities. As Steve said, don't knock it until you've tried it.
I rode the Scott Spark 26 and 29 back to back in Sun Valley, and there were times that both was better and/or more fun. Now I'm riding a 29er hardtail on the Shore and am quite surprised with its capabilities. As Steve said, don't knock it until you've tried it.
Posted by Jerry-Rig at 09:40 AM on 10-31-2011
quote from Ricky Federau:
"My first time ever on a 29er. IT BLEW MY MIND! I will never ride a 26er again. Its so fast and xc feeling, but you can huck and chuck anything. unreal! its only 100mm of travel but its full dude man! I want to race xc again cause of this bike. Its so fast. It feels like you sit in the bike, not on top of it. 26ers are so 2011."
quote from Ricky Federau:
"My first time ever on a 29er. IT BLEW MY MIND! I will never ride a 26er again. Its so fast and xc feeling, but you can huck and chuck anything. unreal! its only 100mm of travel but its full dude man! I want to race xc again cause of this bike. Its so fast. It feels like you sit in the bike, not on top of it. 26ers are so 2011."
Posted by whitehonky at 09:58 AM on 10-31-2011
I ride a HT for most of my winter riding due to lower maintenance and easier to just lube and ride. I've been riding an aluminum all mountain 26er for 3 years.... daily riding on Burnaby Mtn and Eagle Mtn in the winter. I go back to the FS bike in the spring and it's amazing how much your trail reading abilities and control are assisted.
This year the HT was getting long in the tooth and Jordie at DB Burnaby convinced me to tray a 29er and the package he put together made it a no-brainer and worth the 'risk'. Got a Norco Jubei 1 upgraded to a full XT kit. One ride later, and the 'risk' was long gone. So much more compliant than the 26er, once you get the big wheels rolling, that's what they do... roll roll roll roll. Riding with Mrs. WH on well know trails on Eagle and Burnaby with her on the AM FS bike and she's like... I don't know how you can go so fast on that thing. It's not me, it's the bike. If you have the balls to not scrub speed (the downside of 29ers is getting them back up to speed), they blow down the trail. With the right gearing, they climb just fine as well, especially spinner climbs. Tech climbs take some getting used to. I will not got back to 26er for a HT. Any jump or drop on Burnaby, or Shore trails like Pipeline and Ladies are a joy on the 29er HT, rather than just hanging on with the 26er - even with less travel up front.
I won't be buying a 29er freeride bike in the near future, but the next 5" AM bike might be a 29er. On the fence there.
I ride a HT for most of my winter riding due to lower maintenance and easier to just lube and ride. I've been riding an aluminum all mountain 26er for 3 years.... daily riding on Burnaby Mtn and Eagle Mtn in the winter. I go back to the FS bike in the spring and it's amazing how much your trail reading abilities and control are assisted.
This year the HT was getting long in the tooth and Jordie at DB Burnaby convinced me to tray a 29er and the package he put together made it a no-brainer and worth the 'risk'. Got a Norco Jubei 1 upgraded to a full XT kit. One ride later, and the 'risk' was long gone. So much more compliant than the 26er, once you get the big wheels rolling, that's what they do... roll roll roll roll. Riding with Mrs. WH on well know trails on Eagle and Burnaby with her on the AM FS bike and she's like... I don't know how you can go so fast on that thing. It's not me, it's the bike. If you have the balls to not scrub speed (the downside of 29ers is getting them back up to speed), they blow down the trail. With the right gearing, they climb just fine as well, especially spinner climbs. Tech climbs take some getting used to. I will not got back to 26er for a HT. Any jump or drop on Burnaby, or Shore trails like Pipeline and Ladies are a joy on the 29er HT, rather than just hanging on with the 26er - even with less travel up front.
I won't be buying a 29er freeride bike in the near future, but the next 5" AM bike might be a 29er. On the fence there.
Posted by xy9ine at 10:06 AM on 10-31-2011
dammit, now i'm intrigued by these large wheeled wonders.
dammit, now i'm intrigued by these large wheeled wonders.
Posted by FlipFantasia at 10:19 AM on 10-31-2011
wheel stiffness and tire choices are still lacking enough for me to consider one seriously....
wheel stiffness and tire choices are still lacking enough for me to consider one seriously....
Posted by xcolin at 10:25 AM on 10-31-2011
I know the article was about riding north shore trails so I can't really relate, but I finally have come to the conclusion my new XC bike will be with 29" wheels. At the Kaslo Sufferfest this year, the top riders in the 100K race (~10000 feet elevation) were all on 29ers, the top riding a SC Tallboy. Not that it totally proves anything about the bikes, but it's gotta mean something...
I know the article was about riding north shore trails so I can't really relate, but I finally have come to the conclusion my new XC bike will be with 29" wheels. At the Kaslo Sufferfest this year, the top riders in the 100K race (~10000 feet elevation) were all on 29ers, the top riding a SC Tallboy. Not that it totally proves anything about the bikes, but it's gotta mean something...
Posted by nick at 10:35 AM on 10-31-2011
As 29ers get more popular on the shore, I can see lots of busted taco wheels in the future... For most of us I still think for xc it's almost a no brianer but for shore stuff I'm not so sure (we dont all ride like Wade).
Quote:
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Originally Posted by FlipFantasia
(Post 2583509)
wheel stiffness and tire choices are still lacking enough for me to consider one seriously....
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Posted by whitehonky at 10:44 AM on 10-31-2011
It's what I thought as well... especially that much of the 29er rhetoric is about light wheels so you can get that additional rotational size spinning quicker. However, I've got a mid-weight stronger wheelset. Also, remember with the bigger hoops you have more contact patch, so you can run narrower tires than you typically would and still get pretty good grip. Right now I'm running 1.9 contis (something I would NEVER do on a 26er) as they were stock and I've yet to change them out, even in the wet season now.
I'm not dropping 6' on them, but am hitting drops in the 3' range - think Starz and Lower Eagle - without worry of the wheels and all the little jumps on Naheno and Nicole's on my daily commute down the mountain. Haven't trued them yet. And I'm no Wade that's for sure.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by nick
(Post 2583518)
As 29ers get more popular on the shore, I can see lots of busted taco wheels in the future... For most of us I still think for xc it's almost a no brianer but for shore stuff I'm not so sure (we dont all ride like Wade).
|
I'm not dropping 6' on them, but am hitting drops in the 3' range - think Starz and Lower Eagle - without worry of the wheels and all the little jumps on Naheno and Nicole's on my daily commute down the mountain. Haven't trued them yet. And I'm no Wade that's for sure.
Posted by Endless Biking at 11:44 AM on 10-31-2011
Great discussion...
From a Shore perspective, I think a wagon wheel is a perfect ride for average Joe rider in the sense that the wheels roll through the thundering roots much easier. Sections of the Shore which are quite stubborn and rough (Serra's, TNT, East Bridal, Richard Juryn etc) for newer riders are smoothed out and rolled over much easier. Chilcotin trips, BC Bike Race, TOM are some other places where these bikes would help many riders.
Put an expert rider on one and they'll quickly adapt to the strengths of the bike and flow the tech roots & rocks like a DH bike. The quick ups become much quicker as you carry so much momentum as the step-like roots that are about 1' tall feel like 4".
I've personally found the big wheel to be a touch less tricky and flicky and manipulative (sometimes I don't like) and more like a car, just sit in it and go roll over stuff (sometimes I really like!). After extensive testing in 2011, the wagon wheel has a place in my quiver for 2012.
We'll have some Rocky Mountain wagon wheels in our fleet this year, we have one now. If any of you want to go for a rip, let us know!
DB@EB
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gotham
(Post 2583457)
I don't think 29ers are fit to be ridden by average Joes.
Or maybe if we buy a 29er then we will be able to keep up with the pros? |
From a Shore perspective, I think a wagon wheel is a perfect ride for average Joe rider in the sense that the wheels roll through the thundering roots much easier. Sections of the Shore which are quite stubborn and rough (Serra's, TNT, East Bridal, Richard Juryn etc) for newer riders are smoothed out and rolled over much easier. Chilcotin trips, BC Bike Race, TOM are some other places where these bikes would help many riders.
Put an expert rider on one and they'll quickly adapt to the strengths of the bike and flow the tech roots & rocks like a DH bike. The quick ups become much quicker as you carry so much momentum as the step-like roots that are about 1' tall feel like 4".
I've personally found the big wheel to be a touch less tricky and flicky and manipulative (sometimes I don't like) and more like a car, just sit in it and go roll over stuff (sometimes I really like!). After extensive testing in 2011, the wagon wheel has a place in my quiver for 2012.
We'll have some Rocky Mountain wagon wheels in our fleet this year, we have one now. If any of you want to go for a rip, let us know!
DB@EB
Posted by Guest at 11:53 AM on 10-31-2011
Really curious to ride one... until then, I'll refrain from comments.
Kim or Darren - let me know if you ever get a size small test bike or rental bike. I have thrown my leg over lots of mediums, but really want to ride one!
Cheers,
Brian
brian_young@mac.com
@westlioncycling
Really curious to ride one... until then, I'll refrain from comments.
Kim or Darren - let me know if you ever get a size small test bike or rental bike. I have thrown my leg over lots of mediums, but really want to ride one!
Cheers,
Brian
brian_young@mac.com
@westlioncycling
Posted by Oldfart at 01:03 PM on 10-31-2011
That is a myth that won't go away. For a given tire and rim and psi, one being a 29er the other being 26er, the contact patch is the exact same size. The shape is different. 26 will be shorter and wider. It's physics. Even for tires of different width at a given psi and load the contact patch is the same size. Wider tires are preferred because you can run them softer before they pinch flat all the time.
Similar to displacement of water for boats. For example, take two square vessels made of steel. They float. One is 4 feet by 4 feet and the other is 2 feet by 4 feet and they weigh the same. Place 200 pound load in each and how much water do they displace? Same amount. With tires a rider and bike are floating on air. It's not exactly the same as the boat example because a tire encases the air within which compresses under load.
I think the reason 29ers have better traction is simply because they need less traction to keep rolling. Just a theory. I am probably wrong. Not about contact patch though. Here's a cap on road tires:
"Let's assume a 200 pound rider and bike unit. Let's also assume that the weight is distributed half over each wheel. That means that each wheel is supporting 100 pounds. Now, with a pressure of 100 pounds per square inch, the contact patch is one square inch. This is true no matter how fat the tire.
What changes when the tire gets fatter is the shape of the contact patch. With a 20, the contact patch is a long oval. With the fatter tire, the contact patch gets shorter and wider.
When a rider is using a skinnier tire, the long contact patch means he is flexing a wider arc of the tire casing, flexing more of the tire, causing more wasted energy from the internal friction of the tire and tube. The rider with the fatter tire is flexing fewer cords at a time.
There is clearly an optimum size, and the fact that racing tubulars are around 22 should keep us from getting super wide tires looking for yet more speed. Other losses probably kick in as the tire gets still fatter. For me, the bike feels like it doesn't have any snap or jump when we stray from the optimum which I believe to be in that 22-23 mm range."
Sheldon Brown says:
"The part of the tire that is actually touching the ground at any moment is called the "contact patch." Generally, the area of the contact patch will be directly proportional to the weight load on the tire, and inversely proportional to the inflation pressure. For instance, if the rear tire of a bike is supporting a load of 100 lbs, and the tire is inflated to 100 PSI (pounds per square inch) the contact area of the tire will be roughly one square inch. If the pressure is reduced to 50 PSI, the tire will squish out until the contact patch has become 2 square inches (or until the rim bottoms out against the tire.) "
Quote:
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Originally Posted by whitehonky
(Post 2583520)
Also, remember with the bigger hoops you have more contact patch, so you can run narrower tires than you typically would and still get pretty good grip.
|
Similar to displacement of water for boats. For example, take two square vessels made of steel. They float. One is 4 feet by 4 feet and the other is 2 feet by 4 feet and they weigh the same. Place 200 pound load in each and how much water do they displace? Same amount. With tires a rider and bike are floating on air. It's not exactly the same as the boat example because a tire encases the air within which compresses under load.
I think the reason 29ers have better traction is simply because they need less traction to keep rolling. Just a theory. I am probably wrong. Not about contact patch though. Here's a cap on road tires:
"Let's assume a 200 pound rider and bike unit. Let's also assume that the weight is distributed half over each wheel. That means that each wheel is supporting 100 pounds. Now, with a pressure of 100 pounds per square inch, the contact patch is one square inch. This is true no matter how fat the tire.
What changes when the tire gets fatter is the shape of the contact patch. With a 20, the contact patch is a long oval. With the fatter tire, the contact patch gets shorter and wider.
When a rider is using a skinnier tire, the long contact patch means he is flexing a wider arc of the tire casing, flexing more of the tire, causing more wasted energy from the internal friction of the tire and tube. The rider with the fatter tire is flexing fewer cords at a time.
There is clearly an optimum size, and the fact that racing tubulars are around 22 should keep us from getting super wide tires looking for yet more speed. Other losses probably kick in as the tire gets still fatter. For me, the bike feels like it doesn't have any snap or jump when we stray from the optimum which I believe to be in that 22-23 mm range."
Sheldon Brown says:
"The part of the tire that is actually touching the ground at any moment is called the "contact patch." Generally, the area of the contact patch will be directly proportional to the weight load on the tire, and inversely proportional to the inflation pressure. For instance, if the rear tire of a bike is supporting a load of 100 lbs, and the tire is inflated to 100 PSI (pounds per square inch) the contact area of the tire will be roughly one square inch. If the pressure is reduced to 50 PSI, the tire will squish out until the contact patch has become 2 square inches (or until the rim bottoms out against the tire.) "
Posted by whitehonky at 01:11 PM on 10-31-2011
Fair enough and perhaps I used the term 'contact patch' incorrectly. But the 29er tire will be in contact with the ground for LONGER. The 26er is indeed shorter and wider footprint. I think the length of time the tire in on the ground leads to more sure-footedness in a skinnier tire.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Oldfart
(Post 2583578)
That is a myth that won't go away. For a given tire and rim and psi, one being a 29er the other being 26er, the contact patch is the exact same size. The shape is different. 26 will be shorter and wider. It's physics. Even for tires of different width at a given psi and load the contact patch is the same size. Wider tires are preferred because you can run them softer before they pinch flat all the time.
Similar to displacement of water for boats. For example, take two square vessels made of steel. They float. One is 4 feet by 4 feet and the other is 2 feet by 4 feet and they weigh the same. Place 200 pound load in each and how much water do they displace? Same amount. With tires a rider and bike are floating on air. It's not exactly the same as the boat example because a tire encases the air within which compresses under load. Sheldon Brown says: "The part of the tire that is actually touching the ground at any moment is called the "contact patch." Generally, the area of the contact patch will be directly proportional to the weight load on the tire, and inversely proportional to the inflation pressure. For instance, if the rear tire of a bike is supporting a load of 100 lbs, and the tire is inflated to 100 PSI (pounds per square inch) the contact area of the tire will be roughly one square inch. If the pressure is reduced to 50 PSI, the tire will squish out until the contact patch has become 2 square inches (or until the rim bottoms out against the tire.) " |
Posted by Oldfart at 01:18 PM on 10-31-2011
For sure something is happening because of the longer contact patch bridging rough ground better and the angle of attack of the larger diameter wheel is better able to overcome bumps.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by whitehonky
(Post 2583580)
Fair enough and perhaps I used the term 'contact patch' incorrectly. But the 29er tire will be in contact with the ground for LONGER. The 26er is indeed shorter and wider footprint. I think the length of time the tire in on the ground leads to more sure-footedness in a skinnier tire.
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Posted by Guest at 01:32 PM on 10-31-2011
Just so you know, Lenz makes a 7" bike http://www.lenzsport.com/detail.php?prodID=15
Just so you know, Lenz makes a 7" bike http://www.lenzsport.com/detail.php?prodID=15
Posted by reegs at 01:44 PM on 10-31-2011
I just built up a hardtail this fall for winter riding to keep the fitness and skills up. Coming from riding DH pretty much exclusively all summer, it was PUNISHING on the body and the ego. My inclination is to plow through a lot a rough, which isn't an option at all on the HT.
It seems like the bigger 29er wheels would be better in rough terrain at speed, might have to try one to find out...
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Originally Posted by whitehonky
(Post 2583497)
I ride a HT for most of my winter riding due to lower maintenance and easier to just lube and ride. I've been riding an aluminum all mountain 26er for 3 years.... daily riding on Burnaby Mtn and Eagle Mtn in the winter. I go back to the FS bike in the spring and it's amazing how much your trail reading abilities and control are assisted...Any jump or drop on Burnaby, or Shore trails like Pipeline and Ladies are a joy on the 29er HT, rather than just hanging on with the 26er - even with less travel up front.
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It seems like the bigger 29er wheels would be better in rough terrain at speed, might have to try one to find out...
Posted by biggles604 at 01:51 PM on 10-31-2011
I find that DH riders can get really lazy with line choice. Regardless of wheel size, you have to choose lines more carefully on an HT. With a 29er, it will be more forgiving of a line choice error though. At speed a 29er would have an edge because of the wheel size and slightly longer wheelbase.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by reegs
(Post 2583602)
I just built up a hardtail this fall for winter riding to keep the fitness and skills up. Coming from riding DH pretty much exclusively all summer, it was PUNISHING on the body and the ego. My inclination is to plow through a lot a rough, which isn't an option at all on the HT.
It seems like the bigger 29er wheels would be better in rough terrain at speed, might have to try one to find out... |
Posted by morgman at 01:53 PM on 10-31-2011
I've really been enjoying slowing down on the 29er hardtail and picking fun tech lines. You can roll steeper stuff and drops feel like they aren't as big because of the bigger wheel, but it still doesn't like to plow like a DH bike.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by reegs
(Post 2583602)
It seems like the bigger 29er wheels would be better in rough terrain at speed, might have to try one to find out...
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Posted by Jerry-Rig at 02:05 PM on 10-31-2011
4" of travel is still going to feel like 4"... no matter what the wheel size is.
4" of travel is still going to feel like 4"... no matter what the wheel size is.
Posted by clarklewis at 02:09 PM on 10-31-2011
agree with wheel stiffness, though i think there's often too much importance placed on it. having said that, tallboy tracks better with stans flow wheelset (compared to arch), though its heavy.
however, i gained far more front end stiffness recently with a fox 34 (lowered to 120mm) on my tallboy (replacing the 32), than going with a stiffer wheel. carbon hoops would likely help but prices are still exorbitant.
specialized eskar 2.3 is pretty darn good, but the butcher is coming next year, as well as a minion, so that will make things interesting.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by FlipFantasia
(Post 2583509)
wheel stiffness and tire choices are still lacking enough for me to consider one seriously....
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however, i gained far more front end stiffness recently with a fox 34 (lowered to 120mm) on my tallboy (replacing the 32), than going with a stiffer wheel. carbon hoops would likely help but prices are still exorbitant.
specialized eskar 2.3 is pretty darn good, but the butcher is coming next year, as well as a minion, so that will make things interesting.
Posted by reegs at 02:09 PM on 10-31-2011
I only took up DH riding a couple years ago. It took me a while to trust the bike's ability to plow and ride super aggressively, especially coming from a xc racing background when 2" travel forks were a big deal. Now it feels like I'm trying to unlearn that riding style/those (bad?) habits...
Quote:
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Originally Posted by morgman
(Post 2583610)
I've really been enjoying slowing down on the 29er hardtail and picking fun tech lines. You can roll steeper stuff and drops feel like they aren't as big because of the bigger wheel, but it still doesn't like to plow like a DH bike.
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Posted by morgman at 02:10 PM on 10-31-2011
Any thoughts on whether the 29er's more rectangular contact patch would favour particular tread patterns?
Any thoughts on whether the 29er's more rectangular contact patch would favour particular tread patterns?
Posted by Oldfart at 02:24 PM on 10-31-2011
I don't think the shape differential is enough to really matter.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by morgman
(Post 2583616)
Any thoughts on whether the 29er's more rectangular contact patch would favour particular tread patterns?
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Posted by morgman at 02:35 PM on 10-31-2011
In theory, lateral traction would decrease as straight line traction increases. I just feel like the rear end of this bike moves sideways really quick when it's on roots.
In theory, lateral traction would decrease as straight line traction increases. I just feel like the rear end of this bike moves sideways really quick when it's on roots.
Posted by Guest at 02:54 PM on 10-31-2011
From somebody who likes to get into trials like stuff. These bikes are not my choice. I can only have one bike now. The 26 are it even though it's not 6" travel. I also tried one of those fat-bikes. It reminded me of the 29r... rolls really steady and lots of grip over roots at the low psi, but not easily maneuverable. There is a definite trade off going to 29r despite what the positive bits in the article says. The manufacturer are trying to eliminate any negatives, but monster wheels have their place and so do 26in or 24in!
From somebody who likes to get into trials like stuff. These bikes are not my choice. I can only have one bike now. The 26 are it even though it's not 6" travel. I also tried one of those fat-bikes. It reminded me of the 29r... rolls really steady and lots of grip over roots at the low psi, but not easily maneuverable. There is a definite trade off going to 29r despite what the positive bits in the article says. The manufacturer are trying to eliminate any negatives, but monster wheels have their place and so do 26in or 24in!
Posted by Jerry-Rig at 03:28 PM on 10-31-2011
another misconception is that not all 29ers are the same.
If your emphasis is to ride downhill, 26er for sure. If your emphasis is to ride up and/or across, XC race then it's all about the 29er dude.
another misconception is that not all 29ers are the same.
If your emphasis is to ride downhill, 26er for sure. If your emphasis is to ride up and/or across, XC race then it's all about the 29er dude.
Posted by shirk at 03:37 PM on 10-31-2011
Who will be the first person to hit the Twoonie Drop on a 29er?
Who will be the first person to hit the Twoonie Drop on a 29er?
Posted by Oldfart at 04:31 PM on 10-31-2011
Did the article not say that Wade already did it a few times? It's old hat. Been done. I'm not gonna bother.
Did the article not say that Wade already did it a few times? It's old hat. Been done. I'm not gonna bother.
Posted by Oldfart at 04:38 PM on 10-31-2011
Landing a four foot drop yes. Riding across 2 inch high roots and rocks no. Soft tires allow a bike to roll faster and easier over bumps as does suspension. Similarly a larger wheel will allow the bike to roll faster and easier too. It isn't the same as suspension but it does mean something.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jerry-Rig
(Post 2583613)
4" of travel is still going to feel like 4"... no matter what the wheel size is.
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Posted by shirk at 04:55 PM on 10-31-2011
Seems I should actually read the article.
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Originally Posted by Oldfart
(Post 2583688)
Did the article not say that Wade already did it a few times? It's old hat. Been done. I'm not gonna bother.
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Posted by Sharon at 05:04 PM on 10-31-2011
like he needs to go faster! He should be riding a 24'r...
I tried Lee's demo Tall Boy from Steed Cycles. These bikes definitely like to accelerate... makes it tougher on technical trails ( Angry Midget) but one can see the advantage. I"m still not taking the plunge yet. Maybe the 15 year anniversary bike!
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Originally Posted by Jerry-Rig
(Post 2583488)
quote from Ricky Federau:
"My first time ever on a 29er. IT BLEW MY MIND! I will never ride a 26er again. Its so fast and xc feeling, but you can huck and chuck anything. unreal! its only 100mm of travel but its full dude man! I want to race xc again cause of this bike. Its so fast. It feels like you sit in the bike, not on top of it. 26ers are so 2011." |
I tried Lee's demo Tall Boy from Steed Cycles. These bikes definitely like to accelerate... makes it tougher on technical trails ( Angry Midget) but one can see the advantage. I"m still not taking the plunge yet. Maybe the 15 year anniversary bike!
Posted by Da Peach at 06:34 PM on 10-31-2011
I volunteer to be the nsmb average joe test rider.
I volunteer to be the nsmb average joe test rider.
Posted by Carrot Top at 07:55 PM on 10-31-2011
The article says that Wade did the Loonie drop on a 29er not the twoonie
Digger's Rock would be the real test for a 29er
Quote:
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Originally Posted by shirk
(Post 2583667)
Who will be the first person to hit the Twoonie Drop on a 29er?
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Oldfart
(Post 2583688)
Did the article not say that Wade already did it a few times? It's old hat. Been done. I'm not gonna bother.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by shirk
(Post 2583704)
Seems I should actually read the article.
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Digger's Rock would be the real test for a 29er
Posted by syngltrkmnd at 08:37 PM on 10-31-2011
I am not won over by the wagon wheels, but I have been waiting for the day for NSMB to start touting the benefits. I'll give 'em another try, but for now I've got my 26ers built just about the way I want 'em.
I am not won over by the wagon wheels, but I have been waiting for the day for NSMB to start touting the benefits. I'll give 'em another try, but for now I've got my 26ers built just about the way I want 'em.
Posted by whitehonky at 10:02 PM on 10-31-2011
Funny! I thought that was one trail that the 29er totally excelled on! Different strokes...
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sharon
(Post 2583707)
like he needs to go faster! He should be riding a 24'r...
I tried Lee's demo Tall Boy from Steed Cycles. These bikes definitely like to accelerate... makes it tougher on technical trails ( Angry Midget) but one can see the advantage. I"m still not taking the plunge yet. Maybe the 15 year anniversary bike! |
Posted by shiggy at 08:30 AM on 11-01-2011
That should read: "another misconception is all 29ers are the same"
All 29ers are not the same, just as all 26" wheel bikes are not the same. Wheel size is just a part of the differences.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jerry-Rig
(Post 2583660)
another misconception is that not all 29ers are the same.
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All 29ers are not the same, just as all 26" wheel bikes are not the same. Wheel size is just a part of the differences.
Posted by Guest at 12:23 AM on 12-12-2011
Is it just me or do the pics above look quite do'able on a 26" hardtail?
Is it just me or do the pics above look quite do'able on a 26" hardtail?
Posted by cam@nsmb.com at 09:53 PM on 12-12-2011
I hope you can ride what an XC 29er can ride on a 26" wheeled hardtail.
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Originally Posted by Guest
(Post 2597284)
Is it just me or do the pics above look quite do'able on a 26" hardtail?
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Posted by JCL at 12:26 AM on 12-13-2011
If lycra can be banned from DH then 29ers should be banned from XC. They look crap unless you're 6'5"+.
If lycra can be banned from DH then 29ers should be banned from XC. They look crap unless you're 6'5"+.
Posted by Oldfart at 09:22 AM on 12-13-2011
Yeah. And while we are at it, perhaps we can ban tattoos as well. They look like crap. And orange bikes, what a crappy colour. And too many decals on a frame, crappy. And bars with 50mm of rise or flat bars. Both look equally crappy, even if they fit the rider. In fact we should stop riding all together because what if your having a bad day and riding crappy and someone saw you. At World Cup level I think we do away with racing altogether and simply have a runway where judges can determine who looks the least crappy.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by JCL
(Post 2597621)
If lycra can be banned from DH then 29ers should be banned from XC. They look crap unless you're 6'5"+.
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Posted by Jerry-Rig at 11:43 AM on 12-13-2011
some people should be banned for posting.
some people should be banned for posting.
Posted by JCL at 12:30 PM on 12-13-2011
Keep riding the hype train kids:)
Keep riding the hype train kids:)
Posted by nick at 12:37 PM on 12-13-2011
aren't tattoos banned in UCI road racing? I seem to remember something to that effect.
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Originally Posted by Oldfart
(Post 2597679)
Yeah. And while we are at it, perhaps we can ban tattoos as well.
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Posted by Oldfart at 12:44 PM on 12-13-2011
No lot's of pros sport tattoos.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by nick
(Post 2597788)
aren't tattoos banned in UCI road racing? I seem to remember something to that effect.
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Posted by cam@nsmb.com at 05:30 PM on 12-13-2011
I'm not on the hype train (I'm actively resisting) but I am open to the idea that in some situations a 29er might be more comfortable, easier and even in some cases faster. I'm not saying all of those things are always good. Otherwise why would anyone with a duallie own a hardtail? If we really wanted it easier all the time we could just choose mellow trails.
But I do ride suspension bikes and I often choose them for the way they perform - and how they help me perform better and ride faster. One important factor for me is to have a bike that is lively and agile - which aren't characteristics I have often heard about 29ers.
Another reason I resist is that I don't want to stop loving the bikes that are currently in my garage - and I know that is what happens to some people once they get the Koolaid transfusion.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by JCL
(Post 2597784)
Keep riding the hype train kids:)
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But I do ride suspension bikes and I often choose them for the way they perform - and how they help me perform better and ride faster. One important factor for me is to have a bike that is lively and agile - which aren't characteristics I have often heard about 29ers.
Another reason I resist is that I don't want to stop loving the bikes that are currently in my garage - and I know that is what happens to some people once they get the Koolaid transfusion.
Posted by GladePlayboy at 08:47 PM on 12-13-2011
I'm skipping the 29er fad mostly due to the expense of another bike... but I think 650b is where it will be at in the future... best of both worlds.
I'm skipping the 29er fad mostly due to the expense of another bike... but I think 650b is where it will be at in the future... best of both worlds.
Posted by biggles604 at 11:14 PM on 12-13-2011
If 32ers had become popular, would you say that you are skipping the fad and going for a 29er?
If you haven't been on a 29er, then you can't really say what will work best.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by GladePlayboy
(Post 2597937)
I'm skipping the 29er fad mostly due to the expense of another bike... but I think 650b is where it will be at in the future... best of both worlds.
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If you haven't been on a 29er, then you can't really say what will work best.
Posted by cam@nsmb.com at 12:35 AM on 12-14-2011
But he can speculate.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by biggles604
(Post 2597988)
If you haven't been on a 29er, then you can't really say what will work best.
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Posted by Kieran at 07:58 AM on 12-14-2011
I'm getting a 27.5er built. The best of both worlds.
I'm getting a 27.5er built. The best of both worlds.
Posted by DaveM at 08:25 AM on 12-14-2011
I'd defintitely like to see a 29er comparison done by an average joe weekend rider (who is likely the largest consumer demographic) All of the reviews I've seen are done by strong, experienced riders (obviously) that can overcome some of the disadvantages that a 29er has. I'd like to see what a lesser rider feels comparing the 2 bikes. I find one of my most common weak points is losing momentum and having to get back up to speed. It's even worse because I'm usually not in peak physical shape (although round is a shape) and more blunders happen when you get a bit tired. If this becomes a chore on a 29er it would likely zap some of the fun out of things.
I know some of you will say why review for the slow fat people....realistically there's more of us than you buying bikes.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by GladePlayboy
(Post 2583456)
Unfortunately, the cross section of riders outlined here is very skewed toward the expert/pro category. Why not take a group of average Joes and put them through the ringer on 29ers on the Shore? That would provide results that might be more definitive and/or relative.
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I know some of you will say why review for the slow fat people....realistically there's more of us than you buying bikes.
Posted by walleater at 09:19 AM on 12-14-2011
It's funny because it's somewhat true, for me at least. If I was in the market for a new bike, I'm afraid looks would be near top of the list when it comes to buying criteria. I've been around too long to be made to believe that one style of bike will transform my riding. Maybe a course with Endless Biking would though. I totally understand the advantages of 29ers, and some even seem to be designed so they don't feel dull and boring (Kona Honza for example). But I just can't get past the looks of the huge wheels. They seem to go hand in hand with safety vests and trouser / pant clips to me....I just don't care if the big wheels are more efficient.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by JCL
(Post 2597621)
If lycra can be banned from DH then 29ers should be banned from XC. They look crap unless you're 6'5"+.
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Posted by Oldfart at 09:32 AM on 12-14-2011
At a certain point all the reviews in the world are pointless. It is your personal review that counts. I was guilty of 29er prejudice. I'll admit it. Mine was more from the standpoint of being short and not able to fit the bigger wheeled bikes. One ride. ONE ride was all it took. Me Joe average went from a Ibis Tranny to a Giant XTC 29er. Pretty much the same spec other than wheel size. I went with the same rim and tires as the 26 in the 29 version. And 120 fork on the 29 and 100 on the 26. I was used to the ride in 30 minutes. Steering input and feedback was pretty much the same but the smoother rolling is what struck me as being much better on the big wheels. Even more noticeable when I went back to the 26 bike for a ride. I found the small wheels were slowed more or stopped by roots on tech climbs. Momentum loss of big wheels is non existent off road. I think because they roll easier. It is different on pavement or other really smooth trail.
People can theorize all they want but until you actually ride one hard off road on familiar trails, you don't know.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by DaveM
(Post 2598039)
I'd defintitely like to see a 29er comparison done by an average joe weekend rider (who is likely the largest consumer demographic) All of the reviews I've seen are done by strong, experienced riders (obviously) that can overcome some of the disadvantages that a 29er has. I'd like to see what a lesser rider feels comparing the 2 bikes. I find one of my most common weak points is losing momentum and having to get back up to speed. It's even worse because I'm usually not in peak physical shape (although round is a shape) and more blunders happen when you get a bit tired. If this becomes a chore on a 29er it would likely zap some of the fun out of things.
I know some of you will say why review for the slow fat people....realistically there's more of us than you buying bikes. |
People can theorize all they want but until you actually ride one hard off road on familiar trails, you don't know.
Posted by Hola-Day at 01:57 PM on 12-14-2011
Cove has a 18 inch and 20 inch Kona Satori's for demo. Tried one last week on familiar trails. Rode Executoinar DW, then after lunch rode Bridle, Old Buck to C Buster. I really liked the big wheels I'm in the market for a new bike so I'm gonna try one long term. If it doesn't work out I'll just sell it.
Cove has a 18 inch and 20 inch Kona Satori's for demo. Tried one last week on familiar trails. Rode Executoinar DW, then after lunch rode Bridle, Old Buck to C Buster. I really liked the big wheels I'm in the market for a new bike so I'm gonna try one long term. If it doesn't work out I'll just sell it.
Posted by Guest at 01:32 AM on 12-31-2011
650b long-travel. Next year's darling wagon wheel.
650b long-travel. Next year's darling wagon wheel.
Posted by Opinionated Guest at 06:38 PM on 01-01-2012
So everything was the same except you rolled over a root faster and it felt "efficient" ... Damn I guess I better go buy a totally new bicycle frame, fork, pair of wheetsets, stems, bars, cassettes, tires, tubes and a big jug to mix marketing koolaid up to serve my friends.
I already own a cross bike and a nice FS 26" why am I interested in a 29r? I'd rather get a fat-tire bike... watch that sucker roll over roots and grip up climbs. It steamrolls EVERYthing and you can ride it all winter.
So everything was the same except you rolled over a root faster and it felt "efficient" ... Damn I guess I better go buy a totally new bicycle frame, fork, pair of wheetsets, stems, bars, cassettes, tires, tubes and a big jug to mix marketing koolaid up to serve my friends.
I already own a cross bike and a nice FS 26" why am I interested in a 29r? I'd rather get a fat-tire bike... watch that sucker roll over roots and grip up climbs. It steamrolls EVERYthing and you can ride it all winter.
Posted by Oldfart at 05:04 PM on 01-03-2012
Then do that then.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Opinionated Guest
(Post 2603445)
So everything was the same except you rolled over a root faster and it felt "efficient" ... Damn I guess I better go buy a totally new bicycle frame, fork, pair of wheetsets, stems, bars, cassettes, tires, tubes and a big jug to mix marketing koolaid up to serve my friends.
I already own a cross bike and a nice FS 26" why am I interested in a 29r? I'd rather get a fat-tire bike... watch that sucker roll over roots and grip up climbs. It steamrolls EVERYthing and you can ride it all winter. |
Posted by norona at 05:29 PM on 01-03-2012
Your still on straight downhill skis too right cause they still work....
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Opinionated Guest
(Post 2603445)
So everything was the same except you rolled over a root faster and it felt "efficient" ... Damn I guess I better go buy a totally new bicycle frame, fork, pair of wheetsets, stems, bars, cassettes, tires, tubes and a big jug to mix marketing koolaid up to serve my friends.
I already own a cross bike and a nice FS 26" why am I interested in a 29r? I'd rather get a fat-tire bike... watch that sucker roll over roots and grip up climbs. It steamrolls EVERYthing and you can ride it all winter. |
Posted by fullmast at 06:22 PM on 01-03-2012
I just had my hands on a pair of 2012 Volkl Race DH skis, I don't race but the last time I used a set of race DH skis they absolutely slayed in the powder. It was also the last time I used fixed heels of any sort...
Yesterday I had my first taste of the big wheels on a Tallboy and was seriously impressed. It didn't hurt that the trails was pure giggle factor but I would have been smiling on 26" as well.
I've also used/owned(under serious duress) rockered twin tip skis, they were ridiculous in the powder but sucked everywhere else. Full disclosure: I don't ski backwards on purpose.
Given the right conditions and a good skill set it doesn't matter how wide or what the circumference/diameter of your gear is, only the smile on your face.
Speaking as this Average Joe rider; I'm not shopping for a new bike right now but the 29er experience certainly got me thinking about which direction I might turn when it's time to replace my current ride.
I do know I have no desire to go back to twin-tips but that set of DH skis had just the right flex that made me think of the good old days.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by norona
(Post 2603957)
Your still on straight downhill skis too right cause they still work....
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Yesterday I had my first taste of the big wheels on a Tallboy and was seriously impressed. It didn't hurt that the trails was pure giggle factor but I would have been smiling on 26" as well.
I've also used/owned(under serious duress) rockered twin tip skis, they were ridiculous in the powder but sucked everywhere else. Full disclosure: I don't ski backwards on purpose.
Given the right conditions and a good skill set it doesn't matter how wide or what the circumference/diameter of your gear is, only the smile on your face.
Speaking as this Average Joe rider; I'm not shopping for a new bike right now but the 29er experience certainly got me thinking about which direction I might turn when it's time to replace my current ride.
I do know I have no desire to go back to twin-tips but that set of DH skis had just the right flex that made me think of the good old days.
Posted by shore.one at 09:03 PM on 01-03-2012
[SIZE="3"]I know some of you will say why review for the slow fat people
I`m slow and getting to be not so fat. Been riding for ten years mostly on kona`s but switched a couple of years ago to a smaller more pedal friendly bike, re 2009 norco shore one. I know what your thinking but for me this bike at the time was a way more pedal-able bike, after humping my stab up to seventh this thing was a rocket ship on the way up. Over time it became apparent to me that even with the seat slanted as close to level as it could get riding this thing up to seventh was probably going to make me sterile or give me ED.
Not being in a hurry to buy a new bike i checked out every bike shop in town and drooled over all the new bikes, I honestly believe it`s hard to buy a bad bike nowadays but easy to buy a bike not suited for how you really ride. Every time i went into a bike shop i`d immediately check out the dh bikes, as much as i enjoy my shore a true dh bike is in my future. I rented a couple this year in whistler and am pretty sure i`ll be picking up a flatline next year, the one i rented made me giggle like a little girl.
Anyhow in a rare occurrence for me I did the right thing a bought a 20 inch kona satori 29er. Remember I think a shore one is a little bike. This thing rocks. Wheel base is about the same as a shore large so any wood work you ride on now you can manage with this thing. Stock stem is a little long but i`m going to ride it a bit before any changes, it`s never going to lift the front wheel like a freeride bike but takes no time to get used to. On seventh secret i`d bet you it`s just as fast on the way down and dosent give up much on ladys only, there is only one place you have to back off cause the front wheel will get deflected if you try to maintain dh bike speed. You`r probably doubting my claims but ask anybody on a all mountain bike type bike they they will tell you they easily make up any time lost on the true dh part of a trail in the flats. Cleaned ladies for the first time on this thing , feet never left the pedals. Not once. Never. That by it self made it worth the purchase price. My goal is that when my reverb seat post shows up is to got from the car to seventh, ladies, baden powell and back to the car clean.
The biggest difference is before i could manage pedaling up to seventh and riding down. Monday rode up to the mushroom parking lot twice. Sunday rode expresso, ladies, pipeline. Sat was severed and c buster. My wife does not like my new bike.
I`m glad i didn`t go halfway and get an slayer or enduro, i`ve got a bike that will smoke either of those on the way down all ready. I`m not a 29er preacher but
[SIZE="3"]I know some of you will say why review for the slow fat people
I`m slow and getting to be not so fat. Been riding for ten years mostly on kona`s but switched a couple of years ago to a smaller more pedal friendly bike, re 2009 norco shore one. I know what your thinking but for me this bike at the time was a way more pedal-able bike, after humping my stab up to seventh this thing was a rocket ship on the way up. Over time it became apparent to me that even with the seat slanted as close to level as it could get riding this thing up to seventh was probably going to make me sterile or give me ED.
Not being in a hurry to buy a new bike i checked out every bike shop in town and drooled over all the new bikes, I honestly believe it`s hard to buy a bad bike nowadays but easy to buy a bike not suited for how you really ride. Every time i went into a bike shop i`d immediately check out the dh bikes, as much as i enjoy my shore a true dh bike is in my future. I rented a couple this year in whistler and am pretty sure i`ll be picking up a flatline next year, the one i rented made me giggle like a little girl.
Anyhow in a rare occurrence for me I did the right thing a bought a 20 inch kona satori 29er. Remember I think a shore one is a little bike. This thing rocks. Wheel base is about the same as a shore large so any wood work you ride on now you can manage with this thing. Stock stem is a little long but i`m going to ride it a bit before any changes, it`s never going to lift the front wheel like a freeride bike but takes no time to get used to. On seventh secret i`d bet you it`s just as fast on the way down and dosent give up much on ladys only, there is only one place you have to back off cause the front wheel will get deflected if you try to maintain dh bike speed. You`r probably doubting my claims but ask anybody on a all mountain bike type bike they they will tell you they easily make up any time lost on the true dh part of a trail in the flats. Cleaned ladies for the first time on this thing , feet never left the pedals. Not once. Never. That by it self made it worth the purchase price. My goal is that when my reverb seat post shows up is to got from the car to seventh, ladies, baden powell and back to the car clean.
The biggest difference is before i could manage pedaling up to seventh and riding down. Monday rode up to the mushroom parking lot twice. Sunday rode expresso, ladies, pipeline. Sat was severed and c buster. My wife does not like my new bike.
I`m glad i didn`t go halfway and get an slayer or enduro, i`ve got a bike that will smoke either of those on the way down all ready. I`m not a 29er preacher but
Posted by norona at 03:50 AM on 01-04-2012
^ 29'r or 26 inch, this is really what it is all about!:rocker:
^ 29'r or 26 inch, this is really what it is all about!:rocker:
Posted by walleater at 08:04 AM on 01-04-2012
I can't help but laugh at people who are sponsored or employed by companies pushing 29ers. It's almost like a religion. When the 650b takes over in a few years, will you follow your principles or just whoever will sponsor you? Seriously......
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by norona
(Post 2604105)
^ 29'r or 26 inch, this is really what it is all about!:rocker:
|
Posted by Jerry-Rig at 09:07 AM on 01-04-2012
there is no way that a 130mm 29er is faster on the DH than a 160mm bike and yes I have a 130mm 29er.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by shore.one
(Post 2604031)
[SIZE="3"]
I`m glad i didn`t go halfway and get an slayer or enduro, i`ve got a bike that will smoke either of those on the way down all ready. |
Posted by boot at 09:28 AM on 01-04-2012
I'm fairly open minded and respect opinions, but why are pro 29'rs are so adamant? Personally(my opinion), I prefer quick, snappy and stiff. The circus wheels are lethargic in the air, and feel like wet noodles when you lay them down hard in a berm. 29'r definitely has it's niche, but just not for me. I agree that 650b can probably be the best of both worlds.
I'm fairly open minded and respect opinions, but why are pro 29'rs are so adamant? Personally(my opinion), I prefer quick, snappy and stiff. The circus wheels are lethargic in the air, and feel like wet noodles when you lay them down hard in a berm. 29'r definitely has it's niche, but just not for me. I agree that 650b can probably be the best of both worlds.
Posted by norona at 09:31 AM on 01-04-2012
Despite what you think I get to choose my own bike regardless of wheel size and I could care less which bike you buy or what wheel size! However I will give my thoughts on what I like to ride. I had a 26 inch bike ordered and yes after one ride I called them and changed that order. If I ride a 650b bike and like that next season yeah I probably will ride one...does this mean I have no principles? How so? I love being on the cutting edge with bikes, skis, dirt bikes, sleds, etc and I love 4 stroke dirt bikes but probably going back to a 2-stroke does that mean I dont like 4-strokes, absolutely not, but it is nice to see and change it up a bit.
I can't help but laugh at people who are so bitter and believe the world is trying to trick them into purchases. You are making it sound like a religion, have YOU even tried a 29'r or are you just a troll who is having his buttons pushed. I have worked with companies for over 20 years, you don't do that by being fake, dishonest, or subscribing to the latest without some merit. I consider myself lucky to be able to try the latest and greatest, if it works for me I use it, if it does not then i don't, take the bee out of your bonnet!
Love to see if your running a commador 64 or still playing video games on an atari, or driving a 1930 Ford. The equipment is getting better and technology is improving in every thing! Does it mean you have to go out and buy the latest and greatest? Absolutely not, no one is telling you to do anything, people are just giving their opinion on something. I never thought I would ride a 29r in fact I bugged a friend who rode one for the last 5 years, however after just one ride, yes one ride, I am going to ride one...
#1- Because the bike did everything I need in a bike and did it well.
#2- I am the bike buyer for Comor Sports and we are only carrying 29'rs, I felt a little sheepish having never ridden one until recently and did not know how I would suggest selling something I had not ridden. Now I have and I am pumped on our decision to go this route.
#3- I believe that a 26 inch bike will be a hard sell in a season or two to a certain part of the market, this is my opinion and may or may not be the truth
#4- for new riders, the biggest segment 29r's are like parabolic skis, they allow new people to have a better experience on a bike with less time on them and in one word they are FUN!:clap:
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by walleater
(Post 2604127)
I can't help but laugh at people who are sponsored or employed by companies pushing 29ers. It's almost like a religion. When the 650b takes over in a few years, will you follow your principles or just whoever will sponsor you? Seriously......
|
Despite what you think I get to choose my own bike regardless of wheel size and I could care less which bike you buy or what wheel size! However I will give my thoughts on what I like to ride. I had a 26 inch bike ordered and yes after one ride I called them and changed that order. If I ride a 650b bike and like that next season yeah I probably will ride one...does this mean I have no principles? How so? I love being on the cutting edge with bikes, skis, dirt bikes, sleds, etc and I love 4 stroke dirt bikes but probably going back to a 2-stroke does that mean I dont like 4-strokes, absolutely not, but it is nice to see and change it up a bit.
I can't help but laugh at people who are so bitter and believe the world is trying to trick them into purchases. You are making it sound like a religion, have YOU even tried a 29'r or are you just a troll who is having his buttons pushed. I have worked with companies for over 20 years, you don't do that by being fake, dishonest, or subscribing to the latest without some merit. I consider myself lucky to be able to try the latest and greatest, if it works for me I use it, if it does not then i don't, take the bee out of your bonnet!
Love to see if your running a commador 64 or still playing video games on an atari, or driving a 1930 Ford. The equipment is getting better and technology is improving in every thing! Does it mean you have to go out and buy the latest and greatest? Absolutely not, no one is telling you to do anything, people are just giving their opinion on something. I never thought I would ride a 29r in fact I bugged a friend who rode one for the last 5 years, however after just one ride, yes one ride, I am going to ride one...
#1- Because the bike did everything I need in a bike and did it well.
#2- I am the bike buyer for Comor Sports and we are only carrying 29'rs, I felt a little sheepish having never ridden one until recently and did not know how I would suggest selling something I had not ridden. Now I have and I am pumped on our decision to go this route.
#3- I believe that a 26 inch bike will be a hard sell in a season or two to a certain part of the market, this is my opinion and may or may not be the truth
#4- for new riders, the biggest segment 29r's are like parabolic skis, they allow new people to have a better experience on a bike with less time on them and in one word they are FUN!:clap:
Posted by shirk at 09:37 AM on 01-04-2012
LOL If walleater's computer is anything like the bikes he posts then yes he likely is still using a Commodore 64.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by norona
(Post 2604146)
Love to see if your running a commador 64 or still playing video games on an atari, or driving a 1930 Ford. The equipment is getting better and technology is improving in every thing!
|
Posted by biggles604 at 09:39 AM on 01-04-2012
29ers have certain benefits, and to some, those benefits make them a better bike than a 26er. You never see a 29er rider complaining about the cult of 26". Pick the bike you like to ride and respect the fact that other people will have different preferences to you.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by boot
(Post 2604145)
I'm fairly open minded and respect opinions, but why are pro 29'rs are so adamant? Personally(my opinion), I prefer quick, snappy and stiff. The circus wheels are lethargic in the air, and feel like wet noodles when you lay them down hard in a berm. 29'r definitely has it's niche, but just not for me. I agree that 650b can probably be the best of both worlds.
|
Posted by norona at 09:40 AM on 01-04-2012
Dam then i do want to see it! Love to walk into the shag carpet area with those toys and the time it would take to load the boobs thread!
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by shirk
(Post 2604147)
LOL If walleater's computer is anything like the bikes he posts then yes he likely is still using a Commodore 64.
|
Posted by Woodro at 09:46 AM on 01-04-2012
Hey Norona,
What's your wheel choice for booze cruise brakeless escalator rides? 29er or 26er?
Hey Norona,
What's your wheel choice for booze cruise brakeless escalator rides? 29er or 26er?
Posted by biggles604 at 09:46 AM on 01-04-2012
I still have a C64 if you want to buy it ;)
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by norona
(Post 2604149)
Dam then i do want to see it! Love to walk into the shag carpet area with those toys and the time it would take to load the boobs thread!
|
Posted by FlipFantasia at 09:52 AM on 01-04-2012
no, they just talk about how inferior 26ers are in all situations.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by biggles604
(Post 2604148)
29ers have certain benefits, and to some, those benefits make them a better bike than a 26er. You never see a 29er rider complaining about the cult of 26". Pick the bike you like to ride and respect the fact that other people will have different preferences to you.
|
Posted by norona at 10:01 AM on 01-04-2012
Well my sponsor that night gave me a very fitting girls bike!
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Woodro
(Post 2604153)
Hey Norona,
What's your wheel choice for booze cruise brakeless escalator rides? 29er or 26er? |
Posted by shore.one at 07:52 PM on 01-04-2012
there is no way that a 130mm 29er is faster on the DH than a 160mm bike and yes I have a 130mm 29er
I was referring to my shore, start to finish the satori makes for a much faster lap. I will be replacing my shore with a flatline and will occasionally ride it down seventh but any all mountain type bike would make for a waaaayyy faster lap than the flatline. Buy the bike you will personally get the most out of, I ride for the decent and this 29er allows me more time going down hill in a given day of riding.
there is no way that a 130mm 29er is faster on the DH than a 160mm bike and yes I have a 130mm 29er
I was referring to my shore, start to finish the satori makes for a much faster lap. I will be replacing my shore with a flatline and will occasionally ride it down seventh but any all mountain type bike would make for a waaaayyy faster lap than the flatline. Buy the bike you will personally get the most out of, I ride for the decent and this 29er allows me more time going down hill in a given day of riding.
Posted by walleater at 11:42 PM on 01-04-2012
Fair reply and some good disclosure. As for whether I'm trolling, have a Sinclair ZX81 and a dandy horse, my computer is around 4 months old, but as I'm not a fashion victim who buys whatever the media tells me to, it's not a Mac, I've got seven bikes dating from 1952 to present day, 700c, 26" and 24" wheels, Ti, steel, aluminiumum, carbon bits, rigid, full suspension, but yes my latest purchase is a 1991 Offroad Proflex complete with a Flextem :D
I've raced XC at high level, raced DH, CX,road race, road hill climbs, time trials, been an XC guide in Whistler, and as a mechanic seen plenty of stuff come and go / break blah de blah blah blah. So I'm afraid when I'm armed with this much knowledge / experience I'm not necessarily going to believe someone when they tell me that something is better. It's not bitterness. Well, not always :)
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by norona
(Post 2604146)
Despite what you think I get to choose my own bike regardless of wheel size and I could care less which bike you buy or what wheel size! However I will give my thoughts on what I like to ride. I had a 26 inch bike ordered and yes after one ride I called them and changed that order. If I ride a 650b bike and like that next season yeah I probably will ride one...does this mean I have no principles? How so? I love being on the cutting edge with bikes, skis, dirt bikes, sleds, etc and I love 4 stroke dirt bikes but probably going back to a 2-stroke does that mean I dont like 4-strokes, absolutely not, but it is nice to see and change it up a bit.
I can't help but laugh at people who are so bitter and believe the world is trying to trick them into purchases. You are making it sound like a religion, have YOU even tried a 29'r or are you just a troll who is having his buttons pushed. I have worked with companies for over 20 years, you don't do that by being fake, dishonest, or subscribing to the latest without some merit. I consider myself lucky to be able to try the latest and greatest, if it works for me I use it, if it does not then i don't, take the bee out of your bonnet! Love to see if your running a commador 64 or still playing video games on an atari, or driving a 1930 Ford. The equipment is getting better and technology is improving in every thing! Does it mean you have to go out and buy the latest and greatest? Absolutely not, no one is telling you to do anything, people are just giving their opinion on something. I never thought I would ride a 29r in fact I bugged a friend who rode one for the last 5 years, however after just one ride, yes one ride, I am going to ride one... #1- Because the bike did everything I need in a bike and did it well. #2- I am the bike buyer for Comor Sports and we are only carrying 29'rs, I felt a little sheepish having never ridden one until recently and did not know how I would suggest selling something I had not ridden. Now I have and I am pumped on our decision to go this route. #3- I believe that a 26 inch bike will be a hard sell in a season or two to a certain part of the market, this is my opinion and may or may not be the truth #4- for new riders, the biggest segment 29r's are like parabolic skis, they allow new people to have a better experience on a bike with less time on them and in one word they are FUN!:clap: |
I've raced XC at high level, raced DH, CX,road race, road hill climbs, time trials, been an XC guide in Whistler, and as a mechanic seen plenty of stuff come and go / break blah de blah blah blah. So I'm afraid when I'm armed with this much knowledge / experience I'm not necessarily going to believe someone when they tell me that something is better. It's not bitterness. Well, not always :)
Posted by Dude at 09:29 AM on 01-24-2012
Well, I sold my Remedy last night. Not going to lie, it was w/ a small pang of regret and sadness watching the new owner wheel it out of the garage. That bike has been w/ me to Peru on the Big Mountain AM trip (super tech, lots of climbing, and just day after long day of epic riding), raced Nimby twice (or, rode it very slowly twice), and countless great days on Burke, Seymour, Fromme, SFU. It’s been a great AM bike that I can ride anywhere, but now is time to replace.
I spoke to a good riding buddy of mine this morning and told him I sold the Remedy. “Why? Oh no…you’re not going 29er, are you? You are getting old.” So, OK…I can take the abuse, but I do have the same concerns as everyone who isn’t drinking the cool-aid.
Will it go everywhere I want, and everywhere I’ve been on the Remedy? By the sounds of it, the right 29er will. Will it castrate me, so far as switching between bikes and days, i.e.: doing a lot of AM riding, then switching to the DH Bike for a weekend of Garbonzo riding? Reading about the studs riding the 29ers, I doubt it. Also, size…I’m 5’10” ish, and ride a 17.5” AM 26er. Do I now drop a size? I mean, wheel base shouldn’t change much, so???
Help me out here…and where can I rent one? DB…do you have any in your stock yet?
Well, I sold my Remedy last night. Not going to lie, it was w/ a small pang of regret and sadness watching the new owner wheel it out of the garage. That bike has been w/ me to Peru on the Big Mountain AM trip (super tech, lots of climbing, and just day after long day of epic riding), raced Nimby twice (or, rode it very slowly twice), and countless great days on Burke, Seymour, Fromme, SFU. It’s been a great AM bike that I can ride anywhere, but now is time to replace.
I spoke to a good riding buddy of mine this morning and told him I sold the Remedy. “Why? Oh no…you’re not going 29er, are you? You are getting old.” So, OK…I can take the abuse, but I do have the same concerns as everyone who isn’t drinking the cool-aid.
Will it go everywhere I want, and everywhere I’ve been on the Remedy? By the sounds of it, the right 29er will. Will it castrate me, so far as switching between bikes and days, i.e.: doing a lot of AM riding, then switching to the DH Bike for a weekend of Garbonzo riding? Reading about the studs riding the 29ers, I doubt it. Also, size…I’m 5’10” ish, and ride a 17.5” AM 26er. Do I now drop a size? I mean, wheel base shouldn’t change much, so???
Help me out here…and where can I rent one? DB…do you have any in your stock yet?
Posted by lycra_wearer at 10:47 AM on 01-24-2012
not unlike 26ers talking about how inferior 29ers are on the shore. they even feel it necessary to share their opinions with people they don't know that are riding 29ers on the same trails...
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by FlipFantasia
(Post 2604156)
no, they just talk about how inferior 26ers are in all situations.
|
Posted by connor at 12:16 PM on 01-24-2012
want to try my Stumpy 29? It's a M, I'm about the same height.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Dude
(Post 2610883)
Well, I sold my Remedy last night. Not going to lie, it was w/ a small pang of regret and sadness watching the new owner wheel it out of the garage. That bike has been w/ me to Peru on the Big Mountain AM trip (super tech, lots of climbing, and just day after long day of epic riding), raced Nimby twice (or, rode it very slowly twice), and countless great days on Burke, Seymour, Fromme, SFU. It’s been a great AM bike that I can ride anywhere, but now is time to replace.
I spoke to a good riding buddy of mine this morning and told him I sold the Remedy. “Why? Oh no…you’re not going 29er, are you? You are getting old.” So, OK…I can take the abuse, but I do have the same concerns as everyone who isn’t drinking the cool-aid. Will it go everywhere I want, and everywhere I’ve been on the Remedy? By the sounds of it, the right 29er will. Will it castrate me, so far as switching between bikes and days, i.e.: doing a lot of AM riding, then switching to the DH Bike for a weekend of Garbonzo riding? Reading about the studs riding the 29ers, I doubt it. Also, size…I’m 5’10” ish, and ride a 17.5” AM 26er. Do I now drop a size? I mean, wheel base shouldn’t change much, so??? Help me out here…and where can I rent one? DB…do you have any in your stock yet? |
Posted by Dude at 12:53 PM on 01-24-2012
Yes! I'll touch base in the next week or two...maybe we can meet at SFU or Burke for a rip.
Hey, being that you were also on a Remedy, questions:
1. Happy w/ the switch?
2. Did you also cry when you sold yours?
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by connor
(Post 2610948)
want to try my Stumpy 29? It's a M, I'm about the same height.
|
Hey, being that you were also on a Remedy, questions:
1. Happy w/ the switch?
2. Did you also cry when you sold yours?
Posted by connor at 01:02 PM on 01-24-2012
1. so far.
2. I always have good intentions of selling bikes.. however seem to lack in execution..
yeah, meet up for sure.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Dude
(Post 2610958)
Yes! I'll touch base in the next week or two...maybe we can meet at SFU or Burke for a rip.
Hey, being that you were also on a Remedy, questions: 1. Happy w/ the switch? 2. Did you also cry when you sold yours? |
2. I always have good intentions of selling bikes.. however seem to lack in execution..
yeah, meet up for sure.
Posted by norona at 03:27 PM on 01-24-2012
Got it! No one is telling YOU or has told YOU to buy a 29'r. I also never said a 29'r is better than a 26 inch bike or that it will make YOU faster or a better rider! If I said that I did not mean to anyway. But I was pretty pumped on it after one session. Will it make me a better, faster rider, who know's, those days are long gone, for me now it is all about the fun factor and that 29'r made it easier and more fun! After being on new gear every season in over 12 sports for 20 years the one thing I have learned to be, in any sport is, adaptable!
No matter how great people say 29'rs are, YOU always get the final decision whether to try one or not and buy one or not, YOU even get to choose the brand. There is excitement for 29'rs now which is great for riding in general and it is especially great that it helps new riders get into the sport and they are having more fun sooner than we did while grinding our old hard tails along the crazy north shore! More people means more money for everything in the sport from racers to trails, a good thing, I think!
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by walleater
(Post 2604468)
Fair reply and some good disclosure. As for whether I'm trolling, have a Sinclair ZX81 and a dandy horse, my computer is around 4 months old, but as I'm not a fashion victim who buys whatever the media tells me to, it's not a Mac, I've got seven bikes dating from 1952 to present day, 700c, 26" and 24" wheels, Ti, steel, aluminiumum, carbon bits, rigid, full suspension, but yes my latest purchase is a 1991 Offroad Proflex complete with a Flextem :D
I've raced XC at high level, raced DH, CX,road race, road hill climbs, time trials, been an XC guide in Whistler, and as a mechanic seen plenty of stuff come and go / break blah de blah blah blah. So I'm afraid when I'm armed with this much knowledge / experience I'm not necessarily going to believe someone when they tell me that something is better. It's not bitterness. Well, not always :) |
No matter how great people say 29'rs are, YOU always get the final decision whether to try one or not and buy one or not, YOU even get to choose the brand. There is excitement for 29'rs now which is great for riding in general and it is especially great that it helps new riders get into the sport and they are having more fun sooner than we did while grinding our old hard tails along the crazy north shore! More people means more money for everything in the sport from racers to trails, a good thing, I think!
Posted by FlipFantasia at 03:37 PM on 01-24-2012
CONSUME CONSUME CONSUUUUUUUUMMMMMMEEEEEE!!!!
Mitch and Katherine looked to be having a lot of fun on their 26'er hardtails in the montaine vid.....just sayin' ;)
CONSUME CONSUME CONSUUUUUUUUMMMMMMEEEEEE!!!!
Mitch and Katherine looked to be having a lot of fun on their 26'er hardtails in the montaine vid.....just sayin' ;)
Posted by pedalhound at 04:07 PM on 01-24-2012
A bike is a bike is a bike is a bike....ride what you like and stfu.
A bike is a bike is a bike is a bike....ride what you like and stfu.
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